chopnhack Posted April 12, 2014 Report Share Posted April 12, 2014 I am sure you all are aware of my affinity for projects in pine by now... I wanted to make a bookcase for the older child, it was going to be a narrow tall case and being frugal at the moment, cough, cough... I had some syp 2x12 on hand and some recently bought that I brought into the house to acclimate for about 3-4 weeks. I first crosscut these boards to the rough length needed. Next, I ripped them down to about 2 1/2" wide sections to allow for further milling. This is as far as the project would go as the boards had so much internal stress inside, I ended up with bananas :-( Some sections were so bad, they had cup and crook enough to make a hockey player smile... Very frustrating! Has anyone else done a lot of woodworking with construction grade pine? Have you found it to have a lot of internal stress? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
..Kev Posted April 12, 2014 Report Share Posted April 12, 2014 I feel your pain Chop.. Although not pine, as you've probably seen, I'm currently doing some nightstands in Sapele. The wide board that I started with had some twist to it but, seemed manageable. I went ahead and ripped them down and let them sit for a couple days. By the time (couple days) I got back to them, they were so twisted that I couldn't use them at all. I'll use some of it for plug material but, the majority of it is completely useless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chopnhack Posted April 12, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 12, 2014 I feel your pain Chop.. Although not pine, as you've probably seen, I'm currently doing some nightstands in Sapele. The wide board that I started with had some twist to it but, seemed manageable. I went ahead and ripped them down and let them sit for a couple days. By the time (couple days) I got back to them, they were so twisted that I couldn't use them at all. I'll use some of it for plug material but, the majority of it is completely useless. ouch... your board foot price is way more than mine I am sure. I think all told I have about $30 waste. I did find someone semi-local trying to sell some sapele for $3/bd ft. It's a drive, but I am contemplating it!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
..Kev Posted April 12, 2014 Report Share Posted April 12, 2014 ouch... your board foot price is way more than mine I am sure. I think all told I have about $30 waste. I did find someone semi-local trying to sell some sapele for $3/bd ft. It's a drive, but I am contemplating it!! 3 bucks a BF is a pretty incredible price! Fortunately, I wasn't out a lot of material but, it is what it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freddie Posted April 12, 2014 Report Share Posted April 12, 2014 This happened to me with the 10/4 poplar I had on hand for my second door. It was rough milled and seemed ok. Once they were ripped the bent on me real bad, so I shunned them to the corner of the shop and am picking up lvl's tomorrow on the way back from an estimate. The poplar will become template material and shop utility parts as needed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tpt life Posted April 12, 2014 Report Share Posted April 12, 2014 I find construction grade 2x12" to be about 1/3-2/3. Approx 8" can typically be ripped without extreme internal stress while 4" usually cannot be useful. This is not a hard and fast rule, just something I have observed after ripping several tens of thousands of lineal feet of framing members. I usually can guess if a board will be useful on one side rather than another but admittedly I got bit many times. All of that said, 12"s are usually better stock and the narrower the board, the worse success with ripping for clean smaller stock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freddie Posted April 12, 2014 Report Share Posted April 12, 2014 I find construction grade 2x12" to be about 1/3-2/3. Approx 8" can typically be ripped without extreme internal stress while 4" usually cannot be useful. This is not a hard and fast rule, just something I have observed after ripping several tens of thousands of lineal feet of framing members. I usually can guess if a board will be useful on one side rather than another but admittedly I got bit many times. All of that said, 12"s are usually better stock and the narrower the board, the worse success with ripping for clean smaller stock. Such a smarty pants Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric. Posted April 12, 2014 Report Share Posted April 12, 2014 There are a number of factors that contribute to whether or not a board will stay flat, and you have several going against you using construction lumber. The trees are grown too fast and their growth rings are about an inch apart. This makes them less dense and less stable. They're harvested so immaturely that they almost always contain some pith. And they're kiln dried too quickly. I would suggest you go to a dealer and see what they have. Often you'll find some pretty Doug Fir with nice straight grain. Don't be so damn cheap, Chop! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Tom King Posted April 12, 2014 Popular Post Report Share Posted April 12, 2014 When I first started building houses, mills around here sawed the SYP logs, then stacked the boards with sticks and left them to air dry for a year, after that they were kiln dried slowly, and milled to final size with one of the machines being a straight line saw. Even 2x4s would be straight to start with and stay straight. It all ran nicely through a table saw with little to no stress. All these mills have gone out of business because they can't compete with the new methods on price. I bullt houses for ten or twelve years with nothing but nice SYP lumber that has stayed straight. These days, they get the logs on the yard, saw them, kiln dry overnight, and mill them to size the next morning. In less than 24 hours, they are being banded into bundles. You'd better stand back when the straps are cut on a bundle. It's not the SYP. It's the fast and cheap methods. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjeff70 Posted April 12, 2014 Report Share Posted April 12, 2014 What about sticking to quarter sawn stock. I can't imagine the dudes who mill construction grade lumber are milling quarter sawn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wdwerker Posted April 13, 2014 Report Share Posted April 13, 2014 One way to use the SYP available today is buy about 1/3 more than you need a few months in advance and let it acclimate in your shop. Even then when you cut into a plank it can move on you. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chopnhack Posted April 14, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 14, 2014 This happened to me with the 10/4 poplar I had on hand for my second door. It was rough milled and seemed ok. Once they were ripped the bent on me real bad, so I shunned them to the corner of the shop and am picking up lvl's tomorrow on the way back from an estimate. The poplar will become template material and shop utility parts as needed. Ouch brother, that's painful! I still don't know what I will do with 48 b. ft of crappy syp... I can tell you what it is doing - cluttering up my shop! There are a number of factors that contribute to whether or not a board will stay flat, and you have several going against you using construction lumber. The trees are grown too fast and their growth rings are about an inch apart. This makes them less dense and less stable. They're harvested so immaturely that they almost always contain some pith. And they're kiln dried too quickly. I would suggest you go to a dealer and see what they have. Often you'll find some pretty Doug Fir with nice straight grain. Don't be so damn cheap, Chop! I was shooting for a bookcase at under $50 using different techniques ;-) Suffice to say, I lost out on this one... The closest hardwood dealer to me closed last year when the owner past on. The new folks are not up and running yet. The next nearest is over a 50 mile roundtrip. I also have to time it around traffic and procurement of the minivan, removal of kids car seats, not to mention enough expendable coin to make the trip worthwhile... yeah... its a pain in the ass! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bombarde16 Posted May 22, 2014 Report Share Posted May 22, 2014 Begs the question: Are you really being frugal when you realize that framing lumber has a higher waste factor?I've built plenty with 2x12's. I even did a run of bookcases in which I ripped and replied the boards with the grain rotated 90 degrees. (i.e. Turning flatsawn into quarter sawn) Nowadays, I find myself less interested in making excuses for construction lumber. Shop time is just too precious for all that.Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chopnhack Posted May 27, 2014 Author Report Share Posted May 27, 2014 Begs the question: Are you really being frugal when you realize that framing lumber has a higher waste factor? I've built plenty with 2x12's. I even did a run of bookcases in which I ripped and replied the boards with the grain rotated 90 degrees. (i.e. Turning flatsawn into quarter sawn) Nowadays, I find myself less interested in making excuses for construction lumber. Shop time is just too precious for all that. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Maybe not necessarily frugal, but it was what was both available and on hand. I probably have a good 100+ b.f. of syp in the shop, some is over 5 years old (one day a bench perhaps?) I have made other items out of this "worthless" material that turned out fine, but I think dimensionally I was pushing the limits looking for straight, long pieces. It's why its called wood "working" right ;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan S Posted May 27, 2014 Report Share Posted May 27, 2014 Begs the question: Are you really being frugal when you realize that framing lumber has a higher waste factor? The waste factor is higher, but the cost is substantially lower. The following is what SYP is going for at my local Menards. 2" x 12" x 8' $11.85 -> $1.05/bf 2" x 12" x 10' $14.82 -> $1.05/bf 2" x 12" x 12' $16.87 -> $1.00/bf 2" x 12" x 14' $20.49 -> $1.04/bf 2" x 12" x 16' $22.72 -> $1.01/bf 2" x 12" x 18' $31.99 -> $1.26/bf 2" x 12" x 20' $46.69 -> $1.66/bf The next cheapest wood i can get locally is 4/4 poplar at $2.90/bf The other benefit of the construction lumber in my eyes is when I can buy it. My local Menards is open 6:30am to 10pm Monday through Saturday, and 8am to 8pm Sunday. Thus I can pick up a board pretty much whenever i need it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom King Posted May 27, 2014 Report Share Posted May 27, 2014 I buy treated lumber more than a year in advance, and store it in a shed. Any time we are picking lumber for a project, we look through the tops of the wide board stacks, and grab any clear boards in addition to what we are in there looking for. It helps a lot to have two strong helpers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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