Earlex 5500 (Espresso finish)

[yandz]

Brief intro, i'm a novice

I have built a few things a year for a while, mostly just some shelving units, headboards, frames, things like that.  I've always brushed on my finishes and usually just used the readily found stuff at Menards or The Home Depot.  Have used some General Finish products before as well.  I can get a pretty decent finish i've always been pretty happy with, but it takes me a while which requires me to take up a lot of space for lengthy periods of time.

I'll get to my question, I bought the Earlex 5500 after doing some reading on sprayers and getting some advice, no my issue is, i've read enough to know I'm not sure how to start  I got  a waterborne GF (Espresso) stain and figured I'd spray that on and wipe it off for a couple coats then put a finish over it.  Since i've bought it, I still haven't brought it out of the box, and have been doing more reading.  Now i'm not wondering if it wouldn't be better to just brush it on and use the spray to finish only? or if I should not use the stain at all, though my wife loves that stuff, and try to mix a dye maybe to match and spray that?  I've never mixed dyes, but I can usually figure stuff out.

My understanding, and I admit I might be completely wrong, but if I spray the wood, i have to use a pretty hefty dose to keep it wet and wipe off each surface as I go with this GF espresso, or else it will dry before I can get to it creating a uneven stain job?  Is it feasible to spray the inside, wipe, then do the outside? or will excess spray get on unintended surfaces and dry before I get to them ? is the excess so minimal on those surfaces it doesn't really matter?  If I spray too lightly will the stain dry before it is absorbed and just create layers of stain on top of each other and peel off?

I think I understand that with dye, I can just keep coating lightly till I get the desired look?  

I suppose all this depends on wood type and other things, but she really likes the deep dark brown, almost black, but not quite.  and I know there's still going to be a lot of trial and error on my part to get it down, but how would you go about this?  Use the stain and just brush and wipe and use the sprayer to finish?  Spray and wipe and spray finish?  Lightly spray stain and don't wipe?  or learn about alcohol and dye ?

[AceHoleInOne]

What project is going to receive the espresso? A table, book shelf, box. Something large or something small?

 

-Ace-

[yandz]

It is a bookshelf/cubbie  rough dimensions, 6x4 and 12inches deep being frontfaced with oak. varying heights for shelves which will be for combination of decorative stuff and photo albums or whatever else my wife decides she wants there.  So, large by my standards. 

[AceHoleInOne]

The stain must first be thinned with water to spray. Follow the instructions on the General Finishes website of how to thin and spray a stain. If this were me, I would have the spray gun filled with stain in one hand and a stain pad and a pie tin full of stain for the other hand. 

 

The object is to spray and wipe. The spray gun helps to keep a constant flow of stain to the piece maintaining a wet edge. Think of the spray gun as a paint brush applying the stain. Use the stain pad to wipe the sprayed on stain back and to even things out. Then wipe back with a rag.

 

I'm not gonna lie to ya. Bookshelf are tough if the dividers are already set in fixed to the case.

 

Before you start. Take your empty spray gun and a dry stain pad and practice you moves...in its entirety...till you have your pretend stain all over the bookshelf. 

 

Last thing, General Finises sell an extender product  for the stain so it wont dry as fast, which gives you longer working time. 

 

-Ace-

[dwacker]

I would spray it as a tinted finish rather than a spray on wipe off. I don know that the earlex will do that well. GF has videos on you tube showing how they suggest doing it. Personally I would do a lacquer spray stain before trying the speed wipe thing. Lacquer spray stain is easy especially with espresso colors.

[AceHoleInOne]

Something to think about if you go the "tinted finish" route. The bookshelf / cubby will see a good amount of use, yes/no? Tinted finishes will chip taking color with the chip leaving the white wood below. Especially noticeable with espresso finishes. 

 

-Ace-

[estesbubba]

I have yet to spray GF water-based stains but have used them and you have to go fast! I first tried a brush and it started to dry before I could wipe it. Something like this is the trick if you decide to not spray. Put in on quickly and generously.

 

http://www.amazon.com/Padco-1210-Exterior-Paint-10-Inch/dp/B005MI3RK0/ref=sr_1_4?s=hi&ie=UTF8&qid=1417721059&sr=1-4&keywords=paint+pad

[dwacker]

Something to think about if you go the "tinted finish" route. The bookshelf / cubby will see a good amount of use, yes/no? Tinted finishes will chip taking color with the chip leaving the white wood below. Especially noticeable with espresso finishes. 

 

-Ace-

 

Only if you seal them first like they do with cheap furniture. If a sealer is needed with a particular top coat then tint the sealer and no finish lifting. No different than using just a clear finish alone if applied correctly it will not chip. The seal coat is applied the same way in very thin steps so as not to paint on the color. 

 

Laquer stains are much easier because you can see the final results as you go along.

[AceHoleInOne]

The best General Finishes products to spray and wipe are the RTM's. They are awesome with plenty of open time. They do cost a little more but....um,um good!

 

 

Only if you seal them first like they do with cheap furniture. If a sealer is needed with a particular top coat then tint the sealer and no finish lifting. No different than using just a clear finish alone if applied correctly it will not chip. The seal coat is applied the same way in very thin steps so as not to paint on the color. 

 

Laquer stains are much easier because you can see the final results as you go along.

 

Stain or dye will stick and get into the wood. Hence, won't chip off. Adding color over a sealer to white wood, is the same-thing as a tinted finish. Should the sealer chip the color goes with the sealer. 

 

-Ace-

[dwacker]

The best General Finishes products to spray and wipe are the RTM's. They are awesome with plenty of open time. They do cost a little more but....um,um good!

 

 

 

Stain or dye will stick and get into the wood. Hence, won't chip off. Adding color over a sealer to white wood, is the same-thing as a tinted finish. Should the sealer chip the color goes with the sealer. 

 

-Ace-

 

Don't add color over a clear sealer problem solved. The key is to just tint and spray doesn't matter if its tinted sealer on the first coat or tinted finish you will not have any chipping, no different than spraying clear alone. Unless your saying GF clears chip, I doubt that is the case. RTM is not all its cracked up to be and way to expensive even if purchased in volume. I will say its good for color matching as its easy to match the right color on a refurb project and the base is a good blotch control. 

[AceHoleInOne]

Don't add color over a clear sealer problem solved. The key is to just tint and spray doesn't matter if its tinted sealer on the first coat or tinted finish you will not have any chipping, no different than spraying clear alone. Unless your saying GF clears chip, I doubt that is the case. RTM is not all its cracked up to be and way to expensive even if purchased in volume. I will say its good for color matching as its easy to match the right color on a refurb project and the base is a good blotch control. 

 

I don't add color over a clear sealer. That's why on pieces that receive a lot of abuse, such as the case may be here, it's best not to shoot a toned finish as you do.

 

Sorry all finishes can and will chip. So I am saying that about General Finishes. Set just about anything hard down WRONG on a finish, it will chip. Just the facts. Wood is soft under a hard finish. Something has to give and the finish fractures.

 

I LOVE RTM...I have a shop full of Delta equipment...so I have room to splurge on the best finishes money can buy...General Finishes  THAT MY STORY AND STICKING TO IT         Once a finish goes on, you can't tell if its a Powermatic or a Delta that made the cut. HEHEHEHEHE!

 

-Ace-

[dwacker]

 

[dwacker]

Watch this video. You can do this with any stain and topcoat with clear or just stick with the tint. For GF stain all you need is stain with some added maybe 5% topcoat like performance. Thin it out real thin with distilled water. Spray the mixture it will soak in just fine, don't worry about chipping its not going to happen. When you hit the color you want spray a performance top coat. If you don't want to top coat don't thin as much and double or triple the performance. This takes much more practice to keep it from turning to mud so using a clear top coat is easiest for a beginner. if your gun is actually up to the task this is easy to get the hang of with a little practice on some plywood scraps.

You can do the same thing with lacquer or poly it doesn't matter. Lacquer is the easiest, WB next and poly is not for the beginner at all. You do not need any sealers unless you go the lacquer route in that case vinyl is the sealer of choice. Espresso is the easiest finish to do, much easier than light colors.

 

 

[yandz]

Man, I'm glad I asked  Good stuff to think about.  I didn't know much about tinted finishes, or anything really before, so I have more to check into.  I was worried about brushing and wiping such a large project because when i've used it before, it was hard to keep things even because some parts would seem to dry so quickly.  I'll look into the extenders as well. however I do it with the gun, I plan on practicing on some scraps before hand quite a bit.   Now if you'll excuse me, I have a youtube video to watch.  

[AceHoleInOne]

Nice video showing how to spray a stain to white wood, then sealing the stain down so the cabinet can be glazed.

 

Yes a stain to white wood won't chip, as I said above. By mixing a splash of appropriate finish into a stain, doesn't change the stain into a tinted finish. So by thinning down the stain with water, you are reducing the amount of binder in the stain (clear topcoat) binder helps the stain stick into the wood. so by adding back in 5% clear topcoat. Your pretty close back to square one with a full stain.

 

The reason we are thinning the expresso is to get it to spray since its a thick wipe on product.

 

A tinted finish is actually a finish (topcoat) with a color added to it. it's more finish than color. Hence the name its given, "tinted finish"  I know you understand this due to your vast background as a professional wudworker. I'm just stating this information to help out our new friend, so he/she may also gain information.

 

-Ace-  

[yandz]

I am a He, and I do appreciate all the info.  I get to read about glazing too  I grew up the son of a contractor and either stuff was sent to us finished and we installed and my experience with finishing has been oil based stain and poly finish. The only thing I ever thinned was the Poly for the first coat with mineral spirits.  I always thought glazing was something people did with clay.  So i'm definitely not a woodworker, but I try.  I feel like my first project at spraying on a finish is going to be one giant learning experience, hopefully it doesn't take me too many to get i down.  

I'm not in any hurry, and won't start putting any finish on till I feel comfortable doing so.  I might have to do a lot of scraps and some smaller projects before I tackle this one.