Stampy Posted February 9, 2015 Report Share Posted February 9, 2015 I know this isn't a wood working topic but I thought I would appeal to the builders and tradesmen out there. My wife and I started a reno on our house that has become a full rebuild. The house is a craftsman style with shed dormers and shed roofs over the bump outs and 2 rear entrances. The roof are all metal. I visited the site today to find that the roofers had used the back yard for there work area and the lawn strewn with the small triangular off cuts and trimmings that will work there way into the lawn. Poor to say the least. I'm no roofer but if anyone has experience with the pictures that I have posted let me know. There are gaps and bad joints everywhere. The one roof over the back door that will be entirely visible was built without using any ladder braces and they have scratched the paint off the lower edge. Let me know what you guys think. Thanks Stampy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post wdwerker Posted February 9, 2015 Popular Post Report Share Posted February 9, 2015 Talk to the boss first, inspector second, lawyer third if the first 2 don't fix it. Don't pay a dime untill you are happy. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodbutcher74 Posted February 9, 2015 Report Share Posted February 9, 2015 I totally agree with Steve. Along with the lawyer, I would contact the BBB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardA Posted February 9, 2015 Report Share Posted February 9, 2015 Talk to the boss first, inspector second, lawyer third if the first 2 don't fix it. Don't pay a dime untill you are happy. I totally agree with Steve. Along with the lawyer, I would contact the BBB. Put a halt to any further work, It's your money, protect it. And do the above.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janello Posted February 9, 2015 Report Share Posted February 9, 2015 Throw that guy off the job and demand any money you may have given him back. That's shoddy work at it's best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom King Posted February 9, 2015 Report Share Posted February 9, 2015 Good choice on going with standing seam. We spend way more time than I really want to fixing problems behind "professional" metal roofs. One was a 2 million dollar house where every valley leaked. Download the installation instructions for metal roofing. If you can find specific ones for your metal manufacturer it would be best, but really all of them are the same. I think all manufacturers of that type roof must get their rolls of metal from the same supplier, and even use the same roll forming machines. There are specific pieces for all sorts of flashing transitions. With standing seam, we try to not have exposed fasteners anywhere, but there is nothing required in code for that. Make sure the "scratching" on the edges are really scratches, and not simply mark0ff from aluminum ladders. The coating on that stuff is really tough, and you have to almost try to scratch it. Having said all that, if it doesn't leak, you will probably never recoup anything. It wont matter how many experts you get to say that it might leak in the future, if it's not leaking now, it's hard to prove that it will. I don't see anything that says it will leak now, but I can't see what's uphill from that folded down flashing. Unfortunately, most people today want fast and cheap, and value those two things over all others when choosing a contractor, which perpetuates keeping people like this in business. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rapid Roger Posted February 9, 2015 Report Share Posted February 9, 2015 We are currently having our house resided with steel siding (which I know is different than a roof) so, when I saw those pictures, I just had to show them to the foreman of our job. I won't go into what he said but, I'll tell you this, our siding looks 100% better in fit and finish even before any caulking has started. Perhaps the difference is that we have been living in the house the entire time and watching things progress. It has been over a month since this job started because it is February in Kansas (the weather changes by the day) and, they MAKE things fit correctly as they go. I haven't noticed ANTHING being "covered up", "skipped over", or being "ignored" I am impressed with the job I'm getting! I must agree with Steve don't pay a red cent to that contractor until you are happy with the job! Rog Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RPCV_Woodworker Posted February 9, 2015 Report Share Posted February 9, 2015 Take the screwgun, a box of those self-tappers, your contractor, and go to an abandoned lot... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wdwerker Posted February 9, 2015 Report Share Posted February 9, 2015 And get Medieval on him ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom King Posted February 9, 2015 Report Share Posted February 9, 2015 Here's an example of installation instructions: http://www.fabral.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/standnseaminstall.pdfEach variation of roofing has its own set of installation guidelines. For instance the Ribbed metal with exposed fasteners has installation guidelines that are completely different than standing seam, and flashing andaccessories are different.That link above isn't the exact standing seam roofing that you have, but it will give you an idea. The properpieces to fill in between the standing seams at a transition, such as a wall, are called "closures". For yourroofing, which you can order from any Lowes orHome Depot, there are metal closures designed especially to interact with a particular roofing. You can use theEPDM pieces too, but the metal ones make a neater looking job, with no exposed fasteners. They also offer really long life urethane caulking incolors to match any of the roofing colors, or at least I know of a company that does.One big problem with having these comprehensive instructions to follow, is that one has to have the ability to read. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwacker Posted February 9, 2015 Report Share Posted February 9, 2015 Is this a sub or did you hire the roofing co.? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tpt life Posted February 9, 2015 Report Share Posted February 9, 2015 As one who does this work, that is crap in the pictures. While they may have gap stop foam or silicone hidden where you cannot see, fit and finish is not difficult. I would not hire this crew to do any kind of work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom King Posted February 9, 2015 Report Share Posted February 9, 2015 I remembered what the name of the Fabral roofing is that closely matches your roof. This is what I put on the newest additons on our house. The "Z metal closures" pg. 13 are the metal pieces I was talking about. I used these where there is a slope change on our roof, as well as for the ridge cap. Screws go uphill behind the vertical part that fits in between the standing seams. The leg that projects the other way (downhill) is ever so slightly higher than the height of the standing seams. The next part of the system, depending on what it mates to, hooks over that top '"leg". Here's the installation guide for 1-1/2" standing seam: http://www.fabral.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/SSR-Install.pdf On copper roofing I've done, each end of any part is formed to desired shape rather than assembling pieces. See the "roofing" page on my website. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wdwerker Posted February 10, 2015 Report Share Posted February 10, 2015 I love the level of knowledge everyone brings to this Forum ! Thanks Tom . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColinF Posted February 10, 2015 Report Share Posted February 10, 2015 I have no knowledge of metal roofing other than it's slicker than poop on a waxed linoleum floor when it's wet, but I have some cats you can use to fill those gaps!!! Yuck, I'm with RPCV, get the screw gun! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raefco Posted February 10, 2015 Report Share Posted February 10, 2015 …and this is why no one gets their money till the job is done. percentage of completion only when you are happy with what was been completed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RPCV_Woodworker Posted February 10, 2015 Report Share Posted February 10, 2015 I used to work on the rolling mill for a company that made metal roofing (FlexoSpan). Personally, having worked with the standing seam as it comes off of the rolling mill, I'd go with flexbeam or flexrib any day... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stampy Posted February 10, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 10, 2015 Wow!!! And thank you Tom for the comprehensive explanation. I have a friend who is going to do a site visit who used to have a roofing company and also worked as a distributor for a roofing product company so he should be invaluable. I must say thank you to you all for your input. Here is where we are at for now. This is a sub trade doing the work...for now. It is a company that our builder has used for years. After showing the pictures to the builder, they are going to do a walk through with the owner of the company. The sad part of this is that the builder is not the one that noticed this it was us. On a Sunday afternoon. Why wouldn't the builder who is on site everyday notice this and the shards of metal everywhere. The attention to detail is not inspiring confidence at this stage. Stand by for further. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwacker Posted February 10, 2015 Report Share Posted February 10, 2015 Ultimately the contractor is going to be responsible for each of his trades. Im sure it will get worked out in the long run. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wdwerker Posted February 10, 2015 Report Share Posted February 10, 2015 Somebody should drag a big bar magnet all over your yard and around the house. That should pick up the metal shards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodger. Posted February 10, 2015 Report Share Posted February 10, 2015 Or drag the contractor around the yard instead! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stampy Posted February 16, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 16, 2015 Apparently the offending roofs have been replaced by the roofer. More excuses followed from the builder about other deficiencies I discovered that were on the plans from October. I have been away at work so I won't see them till this Thursday.... Standby for further Thank you all for your input Scott Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andrew-in-austin Posted February 17, 2015 Report Share Posted February 17, 2015 I have a stranding seam metal roof, and I am really glad it does not look like that. Sorry you have to ensure this. Certainly the sub is not top notch, but I'd be very concerned about your builder. You may want to hire a independent building consultant to watch, advise, and correct your builder. I very much doubt your builder is going to be honest when his profit is on the line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stampy Posted March 2, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 2, 2015 As many of you were very open with your advice with our roof problem I thought I would update you on what has transpired. My builder and I recently sat down and had a long heart to heart. Funny how life can be. Some very profound parallels in our personal lives have been stressing us all including the roofing contractor who has had his son leave his company suddenly to pursue other avenues. They had a falling out and the affect has been devastating to his father who was planning on retiring and giving him the business. He was his right hand man and the labourers are now doing his roofs. Not a good situation. Our contractor has been dealing with a parent that has an addiction problem and they have decided to move them into their home to support there recovery, And my wife and I have had to deal with the instability of our son's relationship with his girlfriend and our grandson who is 1 1/2. In a nut shell the girlfriend has no support from her family so we have become her surrogate family. A roll we have undertaken with out hesitation but it compromises our relationship with our son. So in the last month we have all had life changing, profound events that have obviously had an effect on how our project has gone at times. The long talk on a Sunday afternoon proved to be good for everyone (although the roofer wasn't there) my sentiments have been expressed through our builder that I want to work with the roofer and not be adversarial. I believe that by being honest and forth right that relationships in these situations can be galvanized in a positive manner. I have extended my friendship and understanding and hope that it will be reciprocated. Our builder has already shown there hand by supporting our displeasure with the roof quality 100%. They have also decided that if the roofer won't make some concessions to fix the situation that they will work to absorb the cost as much as possible. In this day and age of thin margins in any business I genuinely appreciate this gesture. So we will see what can be done with the current roofer to improve the finish quality of our roof and continue to move forward with our renewed confidence in our builder. Incidentally I had a neighbor of ours who does commercial metal roofs come by and have a look. He said that the standing seems our builder has done on flashing and drip edges has been of better quality than the roofing crew All the best Stampy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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