Table saw from Craig's list

[fishywood]

Hello all.  I have taken an interest in woodworking and of course it should all start with the table saw.  also my interests now are making a work bench then shop tables, toy chest, kids table and chairs and the cutting board on ww. I have been searching the posts on Craig's list and seen previous posts about buying on Craig's list. i see the need to buy a better table saw tha the one I wanted to buy before checking this site out. Though oh man just this $220 craftsman and not look back. In the words of lee corso. "Not so fast".  So my question is what am I looking for, how do I know it's not been worn out, only buy when I hear the saw ie?  Also the Craig's list around here is soso with the better listings being around 2 and half hours away so I would like to get the best steak for the money. I will list out a couple of findings today and any advice for the future in purchasing the best saw I can on Craig's list.  Someone posted a grizzly 1022 contractors saw for 350 got them to 300.  Thanks and best regards in advance.

 

 

i will post more findings later. 

[wtnhighlander]

Finding good tools from CL seems to be a bit regional. I see postings for really nice stuff, but never close enough to be practical. A good rule of thumb is never pay above 50% of new retail price. Some well-regarded brands may go higher, but Grizzly isn't one of them. Unless that saw just came off the showroom floor, $300 is steep.

[knotscott]

The 1022 is an average decent Taiwanese contractor saw, that's much like many others that rolled from the same Mao Shan factory under a variety of brand names...it's the fence that makes or breaks it.  Most came with a fairly lame jetlock style fence, but some came with the Shop Fox Classic fence.  With the SF Classic fence and cast iron wings, it'd be worth the $300-$350, but I wouldn't give $200 for one with steel wings and that jetlock fence.  

An older Craftsman saw with an upgraded Alignarip fence would be a better option than the 1022 with a jetlock fence IMO.  

If you post your nearest city, someone here might have a lead on a good saw.

 

[fishywood]

Thanks for the input.  Located near Greensboro.  Here are several other options I have found but at semi long distances.

jet jwts-10sf $350.00, 3 1/2 hours one way

rigid r4516, $175, 2 1/2 hours

delta floor model with dado stack $150, 20 yrs old, 3 1/2 hours

delta model 36-679, $500, 1 3/4 hours

jet m-707000, two blades, $450 obo, 2 hours flat

 

out of these what are the ones I should be interested in and why. What to look for when doing searches?

 

thanks help

[..Kev]

I realize that you're new to the hobby and don't blame you for looking CL to get going.  However, the old saying "you get what you pay for" rings true more times than not when you're not sure what you're looking at or what you need.

Like most of us here, I'm sure you're on a budget.  It will get completely blown if you stick with this hobby, it's just not a cheap hobby.

My advice is to do your research looking at new machines.  Go back thru older posts here and see what the gang likes and dislikes.  See what options are musts and which ones you can do without.  From there, you'll have the education you need to make an informed decision about something on CL or saving your money a little more and buying new. 

Saw stop and Powermatic will be the cream of the crop and you'd pay accordingly.  After that is where the bulk of us live and there's lots of great options out there.

Buy once cry once - IF you're going to stick with this hobby.

[knotscott]

On 2/8/2016 at 8:19 PM, fishywood said:

Thanks for the input.  Located near Greensboro.  Here are several other options I have found but at semi long distances.

jet jwts-10sf $350.00, 3 1/2 hours one way

rigid r4516, $175, 2 1/2 hours

delta floor model with dado stack $150, 20 yrs old, 3 1/2 hours

delta model 36-679, $500, 1 3/4 hours

jet m-707000, two blades, $450 obo, 2 hours flat

 

out of these what are the ones I should be interested in and why. What to look for when doing searches?

thanks help

Since you've been looking at full size saws, I assume there's no need for portability, so I'd eliminate the R4516.  Portable saws can be capable, but their main appeal is portability....no need to give up the operating space, torque, mass, and reliability of a stationary saw....just put it on a mobile base if you need to move it across the floor.  There's a lot more detail about table saws here that might help

There some decent saws in your general vicinity, but many are just priced too high IMO....I suspect some areas just benchmark off each other's prices.  Doesn't mean you can't make a reasonable offer...bartering points are lack of a true riving knife, lack of warranty, and sometimes lack of the original blade guard...whatever is applicable!  

I like this Delta saw, though I'd be offering $350-$400 tops vs an asking price of $500.  Once you get beyond $400, a new saw with a warranty and a riving knife have more appeal...the new 36-725 is about $550, and can be less with coupons.

This Jet 708301 looks to be in good shape and has a good track record.... a little overpriced at $350 IMO.

Here's a decent Craftsman contractor saw that's a bit overpriced....it has a router and router wing built in.  I'd look to get it for ~ $300

Here's another Cman - I'd offer $275 tops

Here's another overpriced Delta - asking $550.  He's overstating the value the fence, and extras....you can get a brand new modern saw for his asking price.  I'm thinking $350-$400 if any of the accessories are worth anything to you.

 

 

 

[fishywood]

Thanks, that gives me a good start. I was hoping to stay around 500 and the 36-725 appears to be a good option.  You're right the Craig's list options are nice but why not go ahead and buy new with a warranty. Going to read the article on table saws.  I will welcome any other comments or opinions.

 

thanks again

[jussi]

Cragslist is definitely a risk vs regards type of venture.  It's true that a new saw will be the much safer bet but you can also get some amazing deals on craigslist.  Many times there are certain tools you wouldn't be able to afford (or justify) buying.  I have a pretty decent shop and 90% of it came from craigslist / estate sales.  Then when you're ready you can sell it (often for more than you purchased) and upgrade to a better machine.  That's how I started.  My tablesaw started as a Ryobi BT3000 and 5 years later and half a dozen saws in between, it turned into a Powermatic 2K. 

If you decide on the used route my suggestion would be to start on a lower priced, but well reviewed saw.  No reason to spend $500+ on a saw and find it's not what you need or, worse, doesn't work properly.  The Ryobi I mentioned had really good reviews for a light duty of saw and I only paid $50 for it so if it turned out to be a dud I wouldn't feel too bad about it.  After you get and use the saw, you learn the ins and outs and when you're ready to upgrade, are more aware of what to look for.  But it's also alot more work.  You have to be more knowledgeable about what to look for, be patient for the right deal (sometimes real patient), and maybe worse of all, deal with people on craigslist :D.  Although to be honest, 95% of the dealings I've had went off very smoothly.  But if you're willing to deal with all that it could be quite rewarding.  At least it was for me.

[sjeff70]

8 hours ago, jussi said:

Cragslist is definitely a risk vs regards type of venture.  It's true that a new saw will be the much safer bet but you can also get some amazing deals on craigslist.  Many times there are certain tools you wouldn't be able to afford (or justify) buying.  I have a pretty decent shop and 90% of it came from craigslist / estate sales.  Then when you're ready you can sell it (often for more than you purchased) and upgrade to a better machine.  That's how I started.  My tablesaw started as a Ryobi BT3000 and 5 years later and half a dozen saws in between, it turned into a Powermatic 2K. 

If you decide on the used route my suggestion would be to start on a lower priced, but well reviewed saw.  No reason to spend $500+ on a saw and find it's not what you need or, worse, doesn't work properly.  The Ryobi I mentioned had really good reviews for a light duty of saw and I only paid $50 for it so if it turned out to be a dud I wouldn't feel too bad about it.  After you get and use the saw, you learn the ins and outs and when you're ready to upgrade, are more aware of what to look for.  But it's also alot more work.  You have to be more knowledgeable about what to look for, be patient for the right deal (sometimes real patient), and maybe worse of all, deal with people on craigslist :D.  Although to be honest, 95% of the dealings I've had went off very smoothly.  But if you're willing to deal with all that it could be quite rewarding.  At least it was for me.

I like this approach for the table saw.  What do you recommend for the jointer and bandsaw?  Especially if you want to saw your own veneers. 

Perusing the interwebs I found plenty of woodworkers who like the old Craftsman table saw and they're making high-end furniture with it.  You can get one that runs great for around $100; $150 if you want a cast iron extension wing.  When you start getting into jointers and bandsaws there are mixed opinions and results.  I'm talking about spending a few hundred for each. 

I haven't seen an old Powermatic machine for less than $1000 in a long time.  At least not one I thought was worth what they were asking.     

[jussi]

1 hour ago, sjeff70 said:

I like this approach for the table saw.  What do you recommend for the jointer and bandsaw?  Especially if you want to saw your own veneers. 

Perusing the interwebs I found plenty of woodworkers who like the old Craftsman table saw and they're making high-end furniture with it.  You can get one that runs great for around $100; $150 if you want a cast iron extension wing.  When you start getting into jointers and bandsaws there are mixed opinions and results.  I'm talking about spending a few hundred for each. 

I haven't seen an old Powermatic machine for less than $1000 in a long time.  At least not one I thought was worth what they were asking.     

For the jointer I would keep my out for Jet, Delta or Ridgid.  I personally had the Ridgid before getting a PM54a and was very happy with it.  I've never used the other 2 but haven't really heard too many negatives.

For the bandsaw I still have 14" a Rikon clone Craftsman.  I don't recall the model number off hand but it looks pretty just like the Rikon except for the paint color.  Again I think delta or Jet 14" would be equally fine.  I think a 14" bs is fine for resawing if you have the right blade on it. You might not be able to push the stock as fast because the motor isn't as powerful, but you should get good results.  I would also use a single point fence.  I do admit the quality is not as good as my friend's Laguna 18 with resaw king.  But all my stuff goes through a planer or drum sander anyways so I'm not overly concerned.

It took me several years to get to the PM2k tablesaw.  I actually only got it a year ago.  Paid $1000 for it and came with a mobile base, router lift, and router.  All of those accessories I already had so I ended up selling them.  You kind of have to becaureful with craftsman brand.  Depending on the model and when/where it was made it could be a great deal or an absolute dud.  This is where forums like this helps alot.  I remember when I first started soliciting advice on forums and asking for opinions on a specific tool I saw.  I was told to pass on alot of the craftsman stuff I asked about.  Many of the newer belt driven stuff made by Orion are great.  I had the higher end zipcode saw 22124 hybrid saw for example and it ran great.  Absolutely loved it and would definitely recommend it if you come across one.  These specific models are discontinued however.  These typically go for around $500 or more so I'm not sure you want to make it your first saw.  Also I've heard many of the direct drive ones are supposedly crap.  No personal experience though. 

The type of items listed on craigslist as mentioned will also vary greatly depending on region.  Along with the prices.  So take that into consideration.  You maybe waiting for a deal that will never come if you live in an area where there is a scarcity of tool sellers.   If you find one though try and check it out asap.  I don't know about your area but in mine, great deals get scooped up quick.  I don't monitor as much anymore since I have most of the tools I'm going to need but there was a time I had alerts from craigslist apps and running rss feeds to give me email alerts when certain items were posted in my area.

Oh and check out searsoutlet site.  Sometimes they have some crazy discounts on returned or cosmetically damaged items that they can no longer sell for new.  I got a carvewright for 1/3 of the price because someone special ordered it and had it delivered to the store and changed their mind about buying it. 

[knotscott]

I'd add Grizzly, Bridgewood, Sunhill, or Woodtek to the jointer list....all from the same factory as older Jet and PM, all a similar design to the RIdgid, all well proven.

[jussi]

28 minutes ago, knotscott said:

I'd add Grizzly, Bridgewood, Sunhill, or Woodtek to the jointer list....all from the same factory as older Jet and PM, all a similar design to the RIdgid, all well proven.

Oh yah forgot about that.  Gee tech right?  

[fishywood]

Thanks everyone for the input. What I have found is that 3/4 miter slot, extension wings, cast iron top if possible, riving knife, are some of the must haves. Is there anything I missed?  

So be on the look out for old craftsman, jet and delta if priced right and any other models that would be a good start?

[jussi]

If you can find one with a cabinet mounted trunnions (as opposed to ones mounted directly to the top) it would make setting the miter gauge and in turn the fence, parallel to the blade much easier.  Riving knife will be hard to find on older saws.  A splitter will be fine, just not as convenient as the riving knife.  Obviously test out the tilt / raise mechanisms and maybe bring a straight edge to check out the flattness (at least of the main table).  Check out which way the blade tilts and see if that will work for you.

[knotscott]

13 hours ago, fishywood said:

Thanks everyone for the input. What I have found is that 3/4 miter slot, extension wings, cast iron top if possible, riving knife, are some of the must haves. Is there anything I missed?  

So be on the look out for old craftsman, jet and delta if priced right and any other models that would be a good start?

The Ridgid contractor saws are directly related to the older Cman saws....out of the same two factories, and many parts are even interchangeable, so I'd definitely include them.  The Ridgids have a better fence....some of the Cman have an "Alignarip" that's a similar style, but some of the old ones had a skinny steel fence that's kind of quirky....ok to buy at the right price, but with the understanding you'll probably want to upgrade the fence some point.  The Delta T2 or T3 fence is ~ $190 at HD, so keep that upgrade in mind as you price a used saw. 

As jussi mentioned, a riving knife is a "nice to have", not a "must have"...a splitter does the same task if you use one.  Some saws are a compact style, and won't be quite full size...the indicator is depth of the cast iron table from front to back - 27" is the standard full size depth.  Belt drive induction motor vs universal direct drive is another biggie to look for....the older standard contractor saws have an outboard belt drive motor hanging off the back.  Some newer designs move the motor inside.  Running it will tell you in a heartbeat if you are not sure....universal motors scream like a circular saw, induction motors hum like a fan.  Solid cast iron wings are a nice to have too, vs stamped steel....I wouldn't walk from a right priced good saw because of steel wings though!  Minor rust isn't hard to cleanup, and can be used to negotiate better price...as can lack of the original blade guard/splitter assembly and miter gauge, and general unkept condition.  I'd walk from severe pitted rust and obvious physical damage.  Motors, wings, fences, switches, miter gauges, blade guards, leg stands, etc., can all be easily replaced...no worries, but things like broken trunnions or gears are much harder to fix.  Don't worry if things like the fence and handwheels don't move as freely as you like....that can be adjusted and/or lubed.

Some of the Grizzly contractor saws have basically the same guts as the old Jet and PM saws, so those can be good depending on the fence....there are many older saws from a variety of lesser known names that essentially have the same guts and came from the same Mao Shan factory as the Griz, older Jet, and Taiwanese PM....Ohio Forge, Bridgewood, Woodtek, Omega, AFF, Mao Shan, etc.  If the price is right, the fence can be upgraded if need be.  To me $100-$175 is the right price if they have the old jetlock fence. Things like an upgraded fence, mint condition, all accessories included, solid cast wings, and mobile bases command more money....some names will fetch a bit more too.   Old Rockwell contractor saws are about the same as some of the older Delta....beware of the cheaper direct drive models though....look for the motor off the back and a full size table.  

Obviously prices vary with each saw, each seller, each region, condition, what's included, etc.

jussi - yep Geetech!

 

Here is a typical Mao Shan contractor saw with their version of the jetlock fence (Jet, PM, Griz, Ohio, Omega, AFF, etc $100-$200):

Here's what is basically the same saw with a different stand under the Bridgewood brand with a nice Vega fence ($250-$350):

Here are some newer versions of the saw above with solid cast or grated cast wings and a Biese style fence under the Powermatic tag (these will command a premium for the condition, fence, cast wings, blade guard, nicer switch, slightly bigger motor, and the brand name...don't overpay just because of the name!...this would be a $300-$400 used saw IMO, some will try to ask $500-$600):

this would be a $400-$500 used saw IMO, some will try to ask $700-$800):

.

Here's a typical older Emerson made Craftsman saw with their standard fence (~$100-$175):

 

Here's nearly the same saw with an updated fence ($150-$225ish):

  

And the Ridgid version of the saw above ($150-$250):

HTH

[Tom Cancelleri]

I've lucked out with Craigslist table saws. Knowing machines and what to look for before buying is important, there are some gems out there for cheap. Read everything about the saw you're going to look at before buying, it helps make decisions and helps with knowing what you're looking at before buying

Sent from my 831C using Tapatalk

[fishywood]

https://raleigh.craigslist.org/tls/5441981302.html

 

seen this today. How decent a deal is this one?  Seems to be a nice saw really wanted to do more research but might not be able to pass on it. Ok so if it is still avaliable what should I inspect for wear and tear?  Check the top for rust, any overall damage, can you check the motor at all. Any other major concerns. Don't want a lemon haha

[sjeff70]

Great replies guys.  The old Craftsman, Emerson models,  are what I was talking about (113.xxx series).  Try to get at least one cast iron extension wing. 

Do I understand correctly that the Rigid contractor saws are comparable to the old Craftman saws?  Are the Rigid motors mounted to the top or off the back?

[knotscott]

4 hours ago, fishywood said:

https://raleigh.craigslist.org/tls/5441981302.html

 

seen this today. How decent a deal is this one?  Seems to be a nice saw really wanted to do more research but might not be able to pass on it. Ok so if it is still avaliable what should I inspect for wear and tear?  Check the top for rust, any overall damage, can you check the motor at all. Any other major concerns. Don't want a lemon haha

Pass...it's a compact direct drive saw with a universal motor, short table, etc.  "DD" in the suffix means direct drive.  

These should have more potential...are any nearby?:

https://raleigh.craigslist.org/tls/5429139170.html

https://raleigh.craigslist.org/tls/5426384269.html

https://raleigh.craigslist.org/tls/5434487967.html

https://raleigh.craigslist.org/tls/5383487678.html

https://eastnc.craigslist.org/tls/5375211051.html

https://greensboro.craigslist.org/tls/5397769422.html (might need a fence)

https://raleigh.craigslist.org/tls/5356898249.html

[knotscott]

9 hours ago, sjeff70 said:

Great replies guys.  The old Craftsman, Emerson models,  are what I was talking about (113.xxx series).  Try to get at least one cast iron extension wing. 

Do I understand correctly that the Rigid contractor saws are comparable to the old Craftman saws?  Are the Rigid motors mounted to the top or off the back?

Yes...when Sears left Emerson in 1997, Emerson started making the Ridgid saws til ~ 2004. In that same time frame, Sears went to TTI/Ryobi overseas to have their contractor saws made,  From ~2004-2008, TTI/Ryobi made the Ridgid TS3650/3660.

Motors hang off the back, trunnions are table mounted.  In many cases the parts of the Ridgid and Cman saws are interchangeable...especially when made in the same plant.

[fishywood]

 https://raleigh.craigslist.org/tls/5383487678.html

 

this one has a lot of accessories with it.  Any other table saws I should consider and offer a lower price?

[knotscott]

22 hours ago, fishywood said:

 https://raleigh.craigslist.org/tls/5383487678.html

this one has a lot of accessories with it.  Any other table saws I should consider and offer a lower price?

That's a good saw with a great fence.  Ask if the blade guard is available.  If not, negotiate a bit.  Keep us posted!

 

 

[fishywood]

No dice. Back to the tabling board lol

[knotscott]

New CL listing!  Ridgid TS3650 in nice shape for $300.  Good fence, Herculift, solid cast wings, good track record, priced right....early bird, etc.! https://raleigh.craigslist.org/tls/5444155620.html

Add another to the list - An older Emerson Cman contractor saw with a Vega fence.  Ok shape, $225....basically getting a Vega fence with a free saw.https://raleigh.craigslist.org/tls/5391791556.html

[wtnhighlander]

I vote for the Ridgid. Mine is older, but the fence is almost identical, and works very well. Herculift is really handy in a garage shop.