Popular Post nerdbot Posted April 14, 2016 Popular Post Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 Well, it's my turn to step up to the plate. I'll be building the WW/Benchcrafted split top Roubo. This is my first journal - online or otherwise. While I'm constantly planning and thinking of the project - I always make cut lists, often make sketchup models, make notes as I go, and occasionally make a step-by-step plan for a critical part of the build - I've never organized those things into a single location (other than in my head). So journaling this whole process will be kind of new to me. On a related note, I also wanted to see how long it would take me to build the roubo, so I downloaded a work tracker app to track my time while working on the project. A month ago, after months of planning, saving, and preparation, I locked in a price on 150+ BF of beech at my local supplier. They only had about 25 BF in stock, so I had to wait for them to source the rest. This past weekend, their shipment arrived and I went over to pick out my boards. Unfortunately, they didn't source as much I had hoped, so instead of a quick trip to pick out "more than enough" boards that would work and figure out the exact cuts when I was back in my shop, I spent a couple hours there figuring out what I could make work with what they had. I definitely didn't want to wait another month for them to source more. I still ended up being a few boards short, but they were still very helpful, bent a few of their rules on partial boards, gave me the sale prices from over a month ago on anything extra I purchased for the build, and threw in free delivery for me. They're not always the cheapest supplier in town, but their service is always top notch. Unfortunately, a handful of their longest boards were right around the 8" mark, so I couldn't quite net out 2 4" boards for the top out of those. At the time, I decided to compromise and go for a top around 3.75" thick. But, when I got home and read over the BC tail vise installation, going significantly less than 4" on the top creates installation problems so I decided I've already invested this much, I may as well do it right and decided to fill in the missing sticks with a few 4/4 accent boards in the top. There's a local sawyer near me that had some really good prices on walnut so I grabbed those and a some 4/4 hard maple. Those boards I had to pick up myself. I attached a couple pictures of 12 10' 4/4 boards in my Accord, stuffed head to toe. Also, a final picture of all the lumber stacked and stickered after it was all delivered. I have a few changes I'm considering, and I'm definitely open to advice. The biggest change is to the lower rails. The current BC calls for a thicker front long rail (3" vs 1.75" from WW plans, I believe), so I'm planning on beefing up all the lower rails to 3" thick - mainly to accommodate whatever caster design I came up with to make the bench mobile. I think I've settled on a separate caster base that, when disengaged, I can roll out from under the bench, and when engaged the bench rests on the mobile base for movement. I like this because it means I don't have to attach any casters to the bench itself, and it also means I can figure out the mobile base solution at some other time while I focus on the bench right now. The other changes are the usual places people put their personal touch - the condor tails (I'm considering a houndstooth design), and the shapes of the deadman and leg vise. I'm trying to exercise as much restraint as possible as all these separate ideas combined could combine to a pretty ugly bench - I'm thinking "Pimp My Ride" style of ugly. As usual, I'll be making prototypes so I can visualize them together - seeing it in SketchUp doesn't quite cut it. While I wait for the lumber to acclimate, I've gone through the lumber and identified and filled any problem areas with epoxy. That's where I'm at as of today. I'll also be doing some quick shop organization projects to make room for the bench once it's done. I hope to have those done in a couple days so I can start on initial milling early next week. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brendon_t Posted April 14, 2016 Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 Sweet, it's about time another one gets going. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janello Posted April 14, 2016 Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 I'll put my 2 cents in. While pimping the ride may turn out nice, this bench is all about work holding in the end. When you actually use it, the bench becomes a tool. Much like you wouldn't redesign a screwdriver, I would be careful in regards to how much you pimp it. I highly reccommend you purchase the guild build for it and don't stray too much from the plans. Good luck, looking forward to watching your build ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nerdbot Posted April 14, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 I completely agree, Janello. Part of the reason I went with beech (even though I was originally thinking of ash in a previous thread), was I saw a picture of the last bench Richard Maguire built. It was built out of solid beech and just had this simple beauty to it. I just want to add a small embellishment or two to 1.) make it "mine" and 2.) challenge myself, in that order. So I have a few ideas where I can do that, and I'm not going to implement all the ideas - I just need to decide when and where. I've already used up one because of the lumber I had available. I have the WWG Roubo project, I've watched it a few times now and have some notes for myself along the way. However, as I mentioned, the BC build has a few small changes because of the hardware changes since Marc built his. The only structural change I was planning on was the thickness of the lower short rails to make sure they're strong enough to be lifted up by the mobile base I'd be making. I haven't updated the model to see if that's more trouble than it's worth yet - thicker lower rails means a change to the mortise and tenons. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post shaneymack Posted April 14, 2016 Popular Post Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 Son of a beech thats a nice pile of lumber ! Someone had to say it lol... I always enjoy a good roubo build, I'll be watching ! Sent from my SM-N910W8 using Tapatalk 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nerdbot Posted April 15, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 15, 2016 In all honesty, that's a good question. My supplier's website says it's European as well as the label on their stacks in the store and it's sold in their exotics section . But, when I googled for information on how to actually identify the difference, that's where things broke down. Wood Database pictures make it look like American beech, but another sites describe American beech is "reddish brown with considerable color variation between boards." My experience with the beech from my supplier is more like the description for European beech, "light orangey-tan colour". Now I just want to know for my own curiosity. But, thanks for the reminder Acer, I'll be sure to mill incrementally. However, I bought 24" x 6" piece of 4/4 beech to play with and they hardly moved at all after jointing and planing down to just under 5/8 a couple months ago. I pulled the board out last week to test finishes on, and there was just a very slight amount of twist, I'd say less than 1/16" across the length. I won't assume the rest of my lumber will behave the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nerdbot Posted April 19, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 19, 2016 Not much progress on the roubo build this weekend. I just went through all the boards and filled knots and cracks with epoxy where necessary. While I waited for the epoxy to dry, and for the boards to acclimate to my shop, I worked on some shop organization to make room for the roubo. 8-ish feet starts somewhere under the front cabinet and ends just short of the metal lumber rack in the back. My new floor standing drill press is also going over there, so obviously that mess is problem #1. Also, right now the roubo lumber is stacked in the area where I would be working, so that is problem #2. The plan is to clear that area so I can stack the lumber there while I work on the actual build. I decided to get rid of that metal lumber rack and put more storage up above, which will give me more room for the drill press without eating into the roubo floor space. I have room to the left of the door for another 2x8 shelf, so that's the first thing I did this weekend. I bought a 16' 2x8 kiln dried doug fir, cut it in half, quickly jointed the edges and glued up my new shelf. I made some additional supports for the half of the shelf that's not sitting on the cabinet, and moved all my plywood on to that shelf and put all my hardwood scraps on the bigger existing shelf. Since the only way to get rid of the mess on the floor is to put that mess up on the wall, I next addressed my wall organization. I wasn't happy with the pegboard I had previously put up for many reasons, so those came down and plywood sheets went up on both sides. While I was at it, I replaced the single outlet in the far back with a double outlet. This is where I ended as of this weekend. I need to finish up the last bit of paneling, hopefully early this week, as well as setting up and testing out my new drill press. Then I can move the lumber stack underneath the cabinets and have room to actually work. One downfall to this plan is that all my tools that were on the wall are now in boxes on top of the tool cubby. So I'll probably have to make a few tool holders for the tools I'll be using for the build, because digging through boxes for the next month or so does not sound like fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
..Kev Posted April 19, 2016 Report Share Posted April 19, 2016 Quite a transformation! Coming along nicely tho! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nerdbot Posted April 21, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 Finished the paneling and setup my new drill press (WEN 4225 15" drill press). For the most part I like it, but there are a few things I don't. But I'll save all that for a product review post in the future. I plan on doing some initial milling tomorrow, breaking down the boards into their rough sizes. I looked into what modifications would be necessary to implement my mobile base idea, and while not impossible, it made me consider simpler options. While I'm not sure how much I'll be moving my bench, if it's like any of my other power tools, it could be moving every time I start a new project. I'd prefer not to attach casters to the bench itself, though if I did, I'd like to hide them a bit. So the options I'm currently considering are: Furniture mover discs/pads under each leg. I'm not sure how feasible that is since I'd have to lift up each leg, slide the furniture mover in, then repeat after I moved the bench into place. The self leveling casters from Woodcraft. Looks like it would do the job, but I don't like that I'd need to adjust each caster individually to raise and lower the bench, and I also don't like how they look. Hook Handmade's vise screw idea (from a different thread here). I really like this one because the casters are hidden for the most part, though I'm not sure if you can remove the vice screw when not in use? It would also require a small modification to the roubo to accomodate this design, but probably much simpler than what I was originally planning. A motorcycle lift like this. I found this suggestion in the comments of the Chris Schwarz article on floor locks. This is essentially the idea I had for my bench, a way to lift the bench and roll it around without permanently attaching any hardware to the bench itself. Presumably this would go in the middle of the bench, but I haven't been able to find any lifts that are 24" wide to engage the two long rails. Use the HTC-3000 base and use it in a similar concept as the motorcycle lift, where I'd roll it into the middle of the bench, engage the levers to lift the bench and roll it around. So, I'm curious, what have other people done? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtnhighlander Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 I have a 5' bench of pine, built Roubo-style. I attached wheels (not casters) to the legs at one end. The are positioned such that the bench rests its feet until I lift the opposite end. The wheels engage as the bench pivots during the lift. On a heavier bench, using a mechanic's floor jack opposite the wheels could help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
..Kev Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 This is what's going on my bench.. They won't be in until Friday so, can't tell you how well they work on a heavy bench yet. They're rated for 400 pounds tho so, should be ok. My base is a little different than most so, I'm able to tuck my in a bit under the ends of the bench.. http://www.rockler.com/workbench-caster-kit-4-pack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brendon_t Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 I like the engage/ disengaged options on the rockler bench casters. One of the things I like most about my Roubo is how damn solid it is. I haven't performed a single operation yet that has moved the bench at all. I would be wary of installing something that keeps the legs off the ground. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nerdbot Posted April 21, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 21 minutes ago, Brendon_t said: I like the engage/ disengaged options on the rockler bench casters. One of the things I like most about my Roubo is how damn solid it is. I haven't performed a single operation yet that has moved the bench at all. I would be wary of installing something that keeps the legs off the ground. Yeah, that's another reason why I'm not a big fan of the self leveling casters. I don't want to use them as the actual feet of the bench. 4 hours ago, TIODS said: This is what's going on my bench.. They won't be in until Friday so, can't tell you how well they work on a heavy bench yet. They're rated for 400 pounds tho so, should be ok. My base is a little different than most so, I'm able to tuck my in a bit under the ends of the bench.. http://www.rockler.com/workbench-caster-kit-4-pack I had looked at these too, and my original idea was to make a seperate base that would slide between the legs of the bench (under the short rails), and then engaging the casters would lift the bench. But 1.) I wasn't sure if the single 8/4 board on each side could handle the stress of lifting the bench and 2.) my bench will probably be close to 600 lbs (150ish BF of beech) so I don't think these casters are strong enough. 4 hours ago, wtnhighlander said: I have a 5' bench of pine, built Roubo-style. I attached wheels (not casters) to the legs at one end. The are positioned such that the bench rests its feet until I lift the opposite end. The wheels engage as the bench pivots during the lift. On a heavier bench, using a mechanic's floor jack opposite the wheels could help. I like this idea as well, but I'm not sure how easy it will be to lift one end of my bench, but I do have a low profile jack that should be able to get under the rails. I think it might be between this idea and the Hook Handmade idea (I updated the link in my post, it wasn't going to the right place before). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
..Kev Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 4 hours ago, nerdbot said: I had looked at these too, and my original idea was to make a seperate base that would slide between the legs of the bench (under the short rails), and then engaging the casters would lift the bench. But 1.) I wasn't sure if the single 8/4 board on each side could handle the stress of lifting the bench and 2.) my bench will probably be close to 600 lbs (150ish BF of beech) so I don't think these casters are strong enough. I promise you that you're bench will not be that heavy unless you do something way off plan.. Mine has a significantly beefier base and a set of drawers and is nowhere near 600 pounds. Will be a bit over a week before I get home and test these wheels on my bench but, it won't be long and I'll post it up. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nerdbot Posted April 21, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 Thanks TIODS, I look forward to it! I've got some time until I get to the base anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
..Kev Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 Just now, nerdbot said: Thanks TIODS, I look forward to it! I've got some time until I get to the base anyway. My "feet" are pretty flay all the way across the bottom. That's why I can mount them pretty much were I want to. Would be a simple modification to the plan to move that stretcher to accommodate the wheels. It will make more sense when you see the pictures.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Llama Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 I'm fairly certain this thread should be called "Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another Roubo"... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
midtnwoodworker Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 14 hours ago, nerdbot said: A motorcycle lift like this. I found this suggestion in the comments of the Chris Schwarz article on floor locks. This is essentially the idea I had for my bench, a way to lift the bench and roll it around without permanently attaching any hardware to the bench itself. Presumably this would go in the middle of the bench, but I haven't been able to find any lifts that are 24" wide to engage the two long rails. If you like this solution just get a couple 2x4's or some scrap metal long enough to span the two stretchers, and mount it to the lift. I personally would probably use the casters, but that's just another idea for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardA Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 50 minutes ago, Llama said: I'm fairly certain this thread should be called "Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another, Yet Another Roubo"... Or we could use an acronym.... OHHWGA [ Oh Hell, Here We Go Again} 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Bob Posted April 22, 2016 Report Share Posted April 22, 2016 When I built my bench I wanted it to be mobile. I put the rockler bench casters on it and discovered 2 things. I can't use the casters simply by lifting the bench and stepping on the caster lever so I had to use a car jack to lift the bench to engage to wheels. Second thing was when I did lift one end I was very concerned that the bench would rack. I found a place in my shop where the bench would be permanently placed and took the casters off. Full disclosure, I did not build a roubo, (cast me out now, banned for life), but in wood alone my bench weighs around 415 lbs. Add vice hardware, fill the five drawers and shelf with important stuff and it is very near 500 lbs. I hope you find a solution, but I don't think the rockler casters, at least by themselves, are a good solution. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
..Kev Posted April 22, 2016 Report Share Posted April 22, 2016 3 minutes ago, Just Bob said: When I built my bench I wanted it to be mobile. I put the rockler bench casters on it and discovered 2 things. I can't use the casters simply by lifting the bench and stepping on the caster lever so I had to use a car jack to lift the bench to engage to wheels. Second thing was when I did lift one end I was very concerned that the bench would rack. I found a place in my shop where the bench would be permanently placed and took the casters off. Full disclosure, I did not build a roubo, (cast me out now, banned for life), but in wood alone my bench weighs around 415 lbs. Add vice hardware, fill the five drawers and shelf with important stuff and it is very near 500 lbs. I hope you find a solution, but I don't think the rockler casters, at least by themselves, are a good solution. That's good info! I had forgotten about your bench when I ordered the casters.. So, will give them a go but, may be in the same boat as you.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nerdbot Posted April 26, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 26, 2016 Well, it took awhile, but I finished the rough milling this weekend. Actually, "awhile" is probably an understatement - according to the app I'm using to track my time, I clocked in at just under 19 hours. But, plenty of music and an audiobook kept me company, so I can't complain. I started by crosscutting all the pieces to rough length with my miter saw. The stand a I had built for it has about 50" or so support on either side, but I still broke out the Ridgid flip top stands for some of the cuts, like when trimming off the ends of the 10' boards. Side note: I only recently found out about these Ridgid stands (either this forum or another), and wow, I wish I had found out about t hem sooner. I have a pair of roller stands that I would use, but they were always finnicky. In cases where I'd need a lot of support, I'd use one of my two Keter work tables (you'll see one in a later picture). Even though I made bases to get as many of my tools at the same height as possible (table saw, miter saw, planer), the Keter work tables are lower so they require "shimming" to get to the right support height (usually stacks of leftover pegboard), and since the tables don't have wheels, any time I need to move the support, I have to remove all the "shims" off the table, move the table, then put the "shims" back. These Ridgid stands have saved me quite a bit of hassle and time. After cutting the boards to rough length, I started ripping the wide pieces to appropriate width on the bandsaw. While I've freehand ripped extra long boards on the bandsaw before, I had a couple boards that were just a bit under 9" and I wanted to get two pieces for the top slab out of them, so there wasn't a lot of room for error. So, I saved those boards for last while I "practiced" on the wider boards. I had about 10 boards that needed to be ripped to width. First picture was the first board I ripped - over 10" wide, so plenty of wiggle room - but obviously my technique needed work. Second picture is the final board, while not perfect, I think shows much improvement if I do say so myself. First rip: Last rip: And a shot of the rough cut base pieces. After the first day, I realized I should put them on the bottom of my lumber stack, so ideally I wouldn't have to move or touch them again until the top slabs were glued up. That saved me a lot of time and effort each day; I'll have to remember that for future projects. I then began the long process of milling the slab pieces to rough dimension. My narrowest piece, after jointing an edge, is 4.25" so that's what I'll be shooting for as final dimensions before the glue up. If all goes well (knock on wood), that should give me enough room to hit 4" on the top. No pictures of the milling process, but the setup was similar to the miter saw setup. I just swapped out the miter saw for the jointer, then swapped the jointer for the planer. At the end of the first day, I had all the 4/4 boards jointed on edge and one face, and planed. They're sitting on one of the two Keter work tables I mentioned previously. I really like them because they collapse down and have some clamps built in. With creative clamping they served me well for the last couple years. The 8/4 beech was in pretty good shape (S4S from my usual supplier) so it didn't require nearly as much milling as the rough 4/4. I skip planed most of the beech boards. One of the 4/4 walnut offcuts caught my eye, so I quickly jointed the face and wiped it with some mineral spirits to see what I was working with. Looking forward to incorporating that into a future project! 19 hours later, everything milled to rough dimensions, stacked with the pieces I'll be working with next towards the top, and all tucked in for the night. I haven't seen any movement in the pieces I milled on day 1 and day 2, so I'm hoping I won't have to do much more before the glue up. I cut the top pieces to 93.5" in length. I'm not sure yet if I want to go for 87" as the final length, or go a couple inches longer if feasible. We'll see how things look after the glue up. I think the overall glue up would go better with as few sticks as possible, so the next step is to rip the 4/4 pieces to about 4.5 inches and glue them up into their "mini-slabs" - a total of four sticks roughly 1.75" thick. Then I'll do a final milling on them to get them to the same dimensions as the 8/4 beech sticks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtnhighlander Posted April 26, 2016 Report Share Posted April 26, 2016 That's a lot of milling, nerdbot! I'll say you did much better at bandsaw ripping than I would. You're going to have a great bench before you know it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaneymack Posted April 26, 2016 Report Share Posted April 26, 2016 Great job Nerd ! 19 hours of milling- WOW ! I think @Tom Cancelleri had his roubo completed at the 19 hour mark ! LOL Looking good man, glad to see you have all the lumber properly stickered after milling. That piece of walnut is amazing !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brendon_t Posted April 26, 2016 Report Share Posted April 26, 2016 Holy milling. Not sure how you could rack up 19 hours milling 18 boards but that is neither here nor there. You're making good progress. Don't be afraid of some pin nails down the center while gluing up the 4/4 to keep from sliding Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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