Low angle smoother as shooting board plane?

[SawDustB]

I've been looking at getting a low angle plane for a while, for end grain work and to use on a shooting board. I was initially thinking I'd go for the low angle jack, since that seems to be a pretty universal recommendation for this kind of thing. This week I realized that my number 4 smoother has a banana shaped sole, with about 1/32 of metal I would need to take off to flatten it (and explains why I've never had it working very well, compared to my other planes). I may still try to fix it, but it's got me thinking of using the remainder of the $250 gift card I bought on Cyber Monday to get the Veritas low angle smoother. I figure this gets me a high end smoothing plane, and maybe also satisfies my desire for a shooting board/end grain plane. Is this a good idea? I don't mind buying a second iron if that makes it more practical. I didn't really need another jack plane, since I've got a vintage Stanley 5, 6, and 7 that all work pretty well.

Anyone have experience with this plane? Lee valley seems to have about 5 different options for smoothing planes, but this seems like the one I would want since it has sides suitable for shooting. I ruled out the smaller version, since that seemed impractical for what I want to do with it. The other option for a smoothing plane is obviously something more like a number 4 or 4 1/2, but that would really only be useful for smoothing.

[Eric.]

It won't be great for shooting as it has very little mass.  You could shoot very small parts but you'll find it lacking for anything bigger.

Also the physics may be awkward the way the tote is all the way at the back of the plane.  Very little leverage near the blade without a hand on the knob.

[SawDustB]

19 minutes ago, Eric. said:

It won't be great for shooting as it has very little mass.  You could shoot very small parts but you'll find it lacking for anything bigger.

Also the physics may be awkward the way the tote is all the way at the back of the plane.  Very little leverage near the blade without a hand on the knob.

Thanks, Eric. I haven't used a shooting board before, so I wasn't sure how much the weight of the plane mattered. They seem to show gripping the plane on that little indent right beside the blade for shooting, rather than the handle. They talk about it for shooting miters, though, which maybe goes to your point about it being for smaller parts.

I did find this picture showing it being used for a shooting board on the fine tools website:

[Eric.]

Yeah you would definitely grip the body of the plane.  I played with the Veritas shooter at the show for about thirty minutes last weekend so I'm still in shooter mode...

[SawDustB]

1 minute ago, Eric. said:

Yeah you would definitely grip the body of the plane.  I played with the Veritas shooter at the show for about thirty minutes last weekend so I'm still in shooter mode...

Their dedicated shooter is a really sweet plane... I've drooled over it in the store a few times. I probably won't go that route since this would be my first high quality modern plane, so I'd like it to ideally perform more that one task for me.

[Eric.]

Honestly if it's gonna be your first plane I'd reconsider the LAJ.  If you plan to have a whole arsenal one day I'd start with a high-quality #4.  I prefer bench planes, personally.

[CandorLush]

For the grip, I heard "That other Podcast" talking about adding hot dog handles for use on a shooting board. 

The link is a hot-to for a Veritas LA Jack but I am sure you can get one made up for the LA Smoother

http://www.inthewoodshop.com/ShopMadeTools/A Hotdog for the LV LAJ1.html

Just saw Eric above me, I don't have any plane that was worth more than $25 brand new in 2017 dollars but I fully plan on a No4 from LV/LN to be my first quality buy

[Immortan D]

The LN LAJ, which is very similar to the LV, is great for shooting and good enough for other tasks. It's a very versatile plane. I use it mostly for shooting or for thicknessing boards (with a toothed  blade).

[gee-dub]

+1 on the LAJ.  I went that way for a few reasons.  Lots of good reports for it as a shooter for those of us who don't have a bevy of planes.  It took the same iron as the jointer and smoother I was considering (and eventually bought).

Unforeseen bonus . . . the same iron size is used in the shooter I received as a gift.

I now have a variety of irons for any of the planes mentioned.  This really ramped up the value for me. The LAJ still gets a reasonable amount of use even though I now have dedicated jointer, smoother and shooter options.  If it ever falls into disuse, the resale value is good and someone else can benefit too.

[SawDustB]

Thanks for the replies, guys. My original plan had been to get a low angle Jack until I realized my smoother didn't work... Like I said, I've got a few other vintage planes that do work well in the jack and jointer sizes. I need to think about it before I run out and just buy both, since with building the Roubo I've just about spent my tool budget for now. Decisions, decisions...

[pkinneb]

4 hours ago, gee-dub said:

. . . the same iron size is used in the shooter I received as a gift.

Nice gift!!

 

[gee-dub]

1 hour ago, pkinneb said:

Nice gift!!

 

Yeah, it took me about 90 seconds to realize I hadn't said thank you . . . I hadn't said anything . . . I was in shock . . . I just kept staring at it with my mouth hanging open.

[derekcohen]

If you need a shooter and a smoother, the Veritas LAS is a great choice. The LAJ is too long to use as a smoother. The LAS may not have its mass, but will do the job pretty well. You will need two blades, one for smoothing and one for shooting.

Here is a review I wrote on the LAS 10 years ago:  http://www.inthewoodshop.com/ToolReviews/The Veritas Low Angle Smoothing Plane.html

A hotdog handle is not needed with the Veritas LAJ or LAS (they are similar in design). Below is a method I described for the LAJ, but is applicable to the LAS as well.

The correct way (in my opinion) of holding the LAJ (and shooting planes generally), is to exert downforce at a central point while simultaneously exerting low lateral sideforce. One must not attempt to simply push the plane against the sidewall to the shooting board. This will unbalance the plane and cause it to cant over.

 

Downforce is applied by the thumb directly into the dimpled fingerhole. Sideforce is applied by the four fingertips pushing from under the levercap.

 

Regards from Perth

Derek

 

[SawDustB]

4 hours ago, derekcohen said:

If you need a shooter and a smoother, the Veritas LAS is a great choice. The LAJ is too long to use as a smoother. The LAS may not have its mass, but will do the job pretty well. You will need two blades, one for smoothing and one for smoothing.

Here is a review I wrote on the LAS 10 years ago:  http://www.inthewoodshop.com/ToolReviews/The Veritas Low Angle Smoothing Plane.html

 

Thanks Derek! Your review was very helpful. Between looking at that, and reviewing the specs on the various options again, I'm thinking that this plane will fill the most gaps for me in my work. I may go take a look at it in person (and if I like it, I suspect it'll come home with me).

[shaneymack]

If you need a shooter and a smoother, the Veritas LAS is a great choice. The LAJ is too long to use as a smoother. The LAS may not have its mass, but will do the job pretty well. You will need two blades, one for smoothing and one for smoothing.

Here is a review I wrote on the LAS 10 years ago:  http://www.inthewoodshop.com/ToolReviews/The Veritas Low Angle Smoothing Plane.html

A hotdog handle is not needed with the Veritas LAJ or LAS (they are similar in design). Below is a method I described for the LAJ, but is applicable to the LAS as well.

The correct way (in my opinion) of holding the LAJ (and shooting planes generally), is to exert downforce at a central point while simultaneously exerting low lateral sideforce. One must not attempt to simply push the plane against the sidewall to the shooting board. This will unbalance the plane and cause it to cant over.

 

Downforce is applied by the thumb directly into the dimpled fingerhole. Sideforce is applied by the four fingertips pushing from under the levercap.

 

Regards from Perth

Derek

 

Derek, didn't you prefer the Bevel up smoother over the low angle smoother?

Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk

[SawDustB]

Well, I went and looked at it after work and it followed me home. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

I'll post a picture if I manage to try it out after I get the kids down. Unfortunately, they only had one pmv11 blade, so I'll have to wait a week or two to get my second one. For now I'll probably just use it as a low angle plane, since I have end grain to clean up on the Roubo.

[derekcohen]

6 hours ago, shaneymack said:

Derek, didn't you prefer the Bevel up smoother over the low angle smoother?

Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk

The BUS is a dedicated smoother. It's curved sides prevent it being used on a shooting board.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[shaneymack]

The BUS is a dedicated smoother. It's curved sides prevent it being used on a shooting board.

Regards from Perth

Derek

I know, I have one. I didn't even realize the OP was wanting a smoother as a shooting plane. Lol. Guess I should finish my coffee before posting

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[SawDustB]

Well, it seems to be working OK for me. I suspect it would work better on the maple with a higher angle, but I've only got the one blade right now and there's a bit more end grain to smooth. So far so good.

[Eric.]

As soon as you encounter even the slightest tricky grain, you're gonna wish you had a high angle blade on there.  When you're super sharp you can get away with straight grain most of the time...best practice is to use a high angle on long grain.  You're just gonna get better results and you don't have to run back to the stones every five minutes.

[SawDustB]

As soon as you encounter even the slightest tricky grain, you're gonna wish you had a high angle blade on there.  When you're super sharp you can get away with straight grain most of the time...best practice is to use a high angle on long grain.  You're just gonna get better results and you don't have to run back to the stones every five minutes.

Yep, that's the plan. I'm only playing with the low angle blade because it's a new toy (I mean tool...). I've back ordered a second blade to get sharpened at more like 35-40 degrees, should have it around the end of the month. Once I've finished with the end grain work for right now, I may just make this blade the higher angle.