Zignot5 Posted November 22, 2011 Report Share Posted November 22, 2011 Hello, I'm new here and looking for some opinions on the quality of the plans/ DVDs from Charles Brock vs Scott Morrison (or if there are others that you like). I looking to jump into a project for the winter that is beyond any that I've tried so far. These seemed like a good place to start. I've been looking at both guy's websites and rocking chair plans. Has anyone tried either of their products? I'm curious to hear some reviews. Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwacker Posted November 22, 2011 Report Share Posted November 22, 2011 One thing about Brock is he is a Festool Junkie . I purchased a copy of his low back chair book and cd for my son in law and its build depends on the festool domino. IMO its a good video and book but rely to heavily on the domino with no explanation of alternative methods. One of the best videos is just the Sam Maloof video there is enough information short of actual plans to get you going on a rocker or any other sculpted chair. Don Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CessnaPilotBarry Posted November 22, 2011 Report Share Posted November 22, 2011 I don't build from plans, but some of the better technique videos, and the closest to a hands-on class, I've seen are Charles Neil's. Along with the Wood Whisperer, of course! They're looooooonnng, as Charles takes his time explaining things, doesn't edit out mistakes, and shares a lot of why with his how. He doesn't often get into tool brands, store bought jigs, one-trick pony tools, micro measurements, and anal-rententive techniques that don't add to the finished product, etc... He will often demonstrate more than one way to do something. Charles is a long-time pro, with a serious book of accomplishments. Since time is money to a pro, many of Charles' methods are simple, common sense, safe, and devoid of unproductive motion. I'm an impatient Northeasterner from Connecticut. In my world, if you don't immediately move when the light turns green, we blow the horn. The first time I watched one of his videos, I thought they were very slow and not so slickly produced. In time, I found myself taking more and more notes, so the timing started to work out, and I started to take notice of the sheer volume of useful information in the lessons. I've been working wood since the early 90's, and have had the good fortune of some very good hands-on instruction. Charles has taught me a few golden tricks, as well as reinforced and refined methods I knew from hands-on classes and previous experience. You can sample his stuff at his site or on You Tube. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zignot5 Posted November 23, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 23, 2011 Thanks for the responses. It looks like there is no really leader, they all have different strong points. I'm really looking to jump into a project that is way over my head in woodworking. I'll probably pick a dvd/ plan at random and see what happens. I guess I'll either end up with a chair or firewood. It will be a great way to learn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CessnaPilotBarry Posted November 23, 2011 Report Share Posted November 23, 2011 Don't forget, the Wood Talk Online podcast has done DVD reviews. Perhaps they've reviewed something that might fit your needs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwacker Posted November 23, 2011 Report Share Posted November 23, 2011 I would pick up the Sam Maloof dvd. Its not a plan but will show you what is involved, besides its just plain a good video. If you decide your up for it then by all means buy a plan and just combine the information. Brock shows how to make the seat joint as does Sam. Brock uses off the shelf router bits Sam uses custom made bits. Sam uses a horizontal boring machine and dowels and Brock uses a festool domino. I think overall Sams method is easier and with a little ingenuity you can get by without the specialty tools. Get ready to make some sawdust. A lot of lumber goes into making these chairs but a great deal of it ends up in the scrap pile or turned to sawdust. Even the little pedestal end tables you end up using about 21 BF just for the pedestal without the top. Don Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulMarcel Posted November 23, 2011 Report Share Posted November 23, 2011 +100 to Charles being a firehose of information in the videos. I don't build from plans, but some of the better technique videos, and the closest to a hands-on class, I've seen are Charles Neil's. Along with the Wood Whisperer, of course! They're looooooonnng, as Charles takes his time explaining things, doesn't edit out mistakes, and shares a lot of why with his how. He doesn't often get into tool brands, store bought jigs, one-trick pony tools, micro measurements, and anal-rententive techniques that don't add to the finished product, etc... He will often demonstrate more than one way to do something. Charles is a long-time pro, with a serious book of accomplishments. Since time is money to a pro, many of Charles' methods are simple, common sense, safe, and devoid of unproductive motion. I'm an impatient Northeasterner from Connecticut. In my world, if you don't immediately move when the light turns green, we blow the horn. The first time I watched one of his videos, I thought they were very slow and not so slickly produced. In time, I found myself taking more and more notes, so the timing started to work out, and I started to take notice of the sheer volume of useful information in the lessons. I've been working wood since the early 90's, and have had the good fortune of some very good hands-on instruction. Charles has taught me a few golden tricks, as well as reinforced and refined methods I knew from hands-on classes and previous experience. You can sample his stuff at his site or on You Tube. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skunkeye Posted November 24, 2011 Report Share Posted November 24, 2011 I have the Brock low back and rocking chair videos, both are fantastic. I can't remember any requirement for a Domino, I think he uses it for the seat glue up and covers placement to avoid exposing a domino during shaping the chair seat, but it is by no means emphasized or required. The Brock videos are excellent, highly recommended. I haven't seen the Scott Morrison videos, the rounded version of the Maloof joint he uses does look pretty spiffy. +1 on Charles Neil, I watched the extra content on Marc's site of the chest of drawer build, then joined his version of the guild. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwacker Posted November 28, 2011 Report Share Posted November 28, 2011 I can't remember any requirement for a Domino, I think he uses it for the seat glue up and covers placement to avoid exposing a domino during shaping the chair seat, but it is by no means emphasized or required. He in no way explains how to do it without the domino. IMO this leave the average guy scratching his head. Placing the dowels perfectly if you dont have a $1K domino is going to be a challenge for most, but a drill press will get the job done with a few jigs. He should have spend the time show this in his video. His video is solely dependent on the use of a domino for the seat. Don Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulMarcel Posted November 28, 2011 Report Share Posted November 28, 2011 $5 of dowel centers and a hole drilled through scrap on the drill press as a drilling guide is all you'd need. They are for alignment and clamping so it isn't like you need 42 of them. Or be fancy and spend another $5 for the appropriate hardened drill guide bushing. Without having watched both videos, can't really say which I'd prefer. A friend of mine is making the low-back chairs from Brock's video and says it is very good (and his chair came out fantastic). He doesn't have a Domino. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwacker Posted November 28, 2011 Report Share Posted November 28, 2011 $5 of dowel centers and a hole drilled through scrap on the drill press as a drilling guide is all you'd need. They are for alignment and clamping so it isn't like you need 42 of them. Im not saying it cant be done, ive been doing them for years without a domino. Im saying he should explain how to do it without the domino. You cant just us straight drill guides you need to make a series of different 3 degree angled guides one for each board in the the seat glue up. The seat is a series of boards glued at different angles and dowels glued at different depths its not a flat glue up. The dowels are for strength. The seats are ground pretty thin and use the 1/2 dowels for strength. A drill press and a dowel center makes it easy without making a bunch of different guides. Don Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skunkeye Posted November 30, 2011 Report Share Posted November 30, 2011 He in no way explains how to do it without the domino. IMO this leave the average guy scratching his head. Placing the dowels perfectly if you dont have a $1K domino is going to be a challenge for most, but a drill press will get the job done with a few jigs. He should have spend the time show this in his video. His video is solely dependent on the use of a domino for the seat. Don The seat is a pretty darn simple panel type glue up with a couple of beveled edges, as it is all long grain to long grain a biscuit or domino is basically for alignment and adds nothing to strength. If the chair seat fails it won't be for lack of a dowel or domino. If alignment is vexing, just use a few clipped brads to keep the boards even. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwacker Posted November 30, 2011 Report Share Posted November 30, 2011 The seat is a pretty darn simple panel type glue up with a couple of beveled edges, as it is all long grain to long grain a biscuit or domino is basically for alignment and adds nothing to strength. If the chair seat fails it won't be for lack of a dowel or domino. If alignment is vexing, just use a few clipped brads to keep the boards even. Sorry but thats not accurate. The glue up it self really needs no alignment aids what so ever and is pretty basic. Sam used the oposing large dowel to prevent warping and as a fulcrom for heavier butts, he explains this in his video. He also had early seats in the shop without the big dowels. If you take the shop tour his current staff will show you why they are there. Its one of the things he did that perplexed woodworkers for years. Don Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zignot5 Posted November 30, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 30, 2011 Hey everyone I just wanted to say thanks for all the great info! I appreciate all the great responses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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