GFCI electrical outlet and lathe


Indy Cindy

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Garage is too broad. I suspect most codes will stick to proximity and usage for those regs. You likely still have to GF for outlets close to the exterior entrances and any water source like a sink?

sorry, attached garage.  

I have an outlet directly above a hose bib in my garage, and asked about gfci, and was told not required.

Outdoor receptacles and carport receptacles require gfci.

Edited by franklin pug
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I’m not sure about Ontario, but US municipalities (and more importantly, their inspectors) tend to be conservative on reading NEC. If something is not black-letter, but mute or open to interpretation, they can make you do it to get a sticker... Same goes for what’s announced as future code... You can appeal – and maybe win – but you’d better not need an inspection in the future... Usually it’s just a few $$, so it’s cheaper to do what the inspector wants and not fight it... After all, how much incremental spend is a GCFI device or three? You buy a $1600 lathe and spend $300 for the electric to operate it – who really cares about an extra $30??

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I’m not sure about Ontario, but US municipalities (and more importantly, their inspectors) tend to be conservative on reading NEC. If something is not black-letter, but mute or open to interpretation, they can make you do it to get a sticker... Same goes for what’s announced as future code... You can appeal – and maybe win – but you’d better not need an inspection in the future... Usually it’s just a few $$, so it’s cheaper to do what the inspector wants and not fight it... After all, how much incremental spend is a GCFI device or three? You buy a $1600 lathe and spend $300 for the electric to operate it – who really cares about an extra $30??

 

i agree with you, and code is bare bones.  It could be an issue for someone who ran 3 wire cable however, and was then forced to upgrade to an afci breaker, knowing that existing code allowed for a standard 2 pole breaker in their garage/shop.

I looked at gfci and afci breaker today for interest, and they can be crazy money here.  Some are pushing 200 each!

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I don't sweat fixtures. Wire gauge and the ability to make some modular changes come into play in my shop mind. This means I conduit the shop in a Romex house. The swapping of a breaker or receptacle are easily done. The pulling of new wire Can be easily done with the right planning. With the appropriate insurance caveats spoken, just be sure you can appropriately install GCFI if you need to be inspected down the road for sticker or sale.  Two more cents. 

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I’m not sure about Ontario, but US municipalities (and more importantly, their inspectors) tend to be conservative on reading NEC. If something is not black-letter, but mute or open to interpretation, they can make you do it to get a sticker... Same goes for what’s announced as future code... You can appeal – and maybe win – but you’d better not need an inspection in the future... Usually it’s just a few $$, so it’s cheaper to do what the inspector wants and not fight it... After all, how much incremental spend is a GCFI device or three? You buy a $1600 lathe and spend $300 for the electric to operate it – who really cares about an extra $30??

 

Price is not the point. I had the GFCI outlets already installed as part of the electrical upgrade. The lathe would not run on GFCI. The only question was whether or not a non-GFCI outlet could be installed in place of the GFCI outlet so I could run the lathe. The electrician did so and all is good. Also, FWIW the lathe is >$2K (sales price), electric installation in garage was >$2500. We're not quibbling about  $30, just the ability to run the lathe. All other circuits in the garage are still GFCI protected.

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Sorry CI -- was leveraging your install to address the complainace issue... My bad...

 

BTW: that's a lot for electric work... Was it a detached garage, trench and sub-panel?

 

==>$200 for a device

Is that a whole-panel GF device? I think individual outlets are around $10/each around here...

Edited by hhh
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Sorry CI -- was leveraging your install to address the complainace issue... My bad...

 

BTW: that's a lot for electric work... Was it a detached garage, trench and sub-panel?

 

==>$200 for a device

Is that a whole-panel GF device? I think individual outlets are around $10/each around here...

yes, for a breaker.

http://www.homedepot.ca/product/20a-2-pole-120-240v-siemens-type-q-gfci-breaker/941175

Individual devices are about the same as you mentioned.

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Sorry CI -- was leveraging your install to address the complainace issue... My bad...

 

BTW: that's a lot for electric work... Was it a detached garage, trench and sub-panel?

 

==>$200 for a device

Is that a whole-panel GF device? I think individual outlets are around $10/each around here...

No problem. :)

Attached garage but we have a big tri-level with power coming in from the exact opposite corner from the garage and attics over the three levels of the house that don't quite match up. We had 3 bids and 3 entirely different approaches to the problem. 1st guy never came back with a bid after repeated prompting. 2nd company wanted $5k and had an unnecessarily complicated approach, 3rd company was more common sense and cost the $2.6k. We ran a line out from our house panel, under a deck, around the corner of a brick patio, up a wall into the garage soffit and attic over to my half of the garage and down to install the 60 A sub panel. Four 20 A circuits were run from there. Up until now I had one 15 A circuit in the garage and I ran an extension cord into the house for another 15 A circuit so I could run my shop vac. I'm really happy now to have more power! In the grand scheme of things on how much money I spend on this hobby it is worth it. I now have light (yay!) and a big lathe (yay!) and am ready to install an air cleaner (yay!). I have family visiting for the last week and am looking forward to getting out there and putting it all to use.

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==>We ran a line out from our house panel, under a deck, around the corner of a brick patio, up a wall into the garage soffit and attic over to my half of the garage and down to install the 60 A sub panel. Four 20 A circuits were run from there.

Wow... I'd just move... :)

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==>We ran a line out from our house panel, under a deck, around the corner of a brick patio, up a wall into the garage soffit and attic over to my half of the garage and down to install the 60 A sub panel. Four 20 A circuits were run from there.

Wow... I'd just move... :)

Thought about it but love the house and location. Now I have power so staying put!

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In our city, by code, any attached garage must have all outlets GFCI'ed.  When I updated my Garage electricity we installed  a 60 amp sub-panel in the garage (4 x 20 amp 110vac circuits each with a 4-plex and two 20 amp 220 vac circuits) and installed a GFCI breaker at the main panel.  The 60 amp GFCI breaker (Cutler Hammer) was about $250.  And while Cutler Hammer tends to be the most expensive breakers, if you have a CH panel, you don't have a choice, it accepts CH breakers only. Fortunately, my upgrade was less than $1000, with me doing most of the grunt work (digging and installing the conduit, installing the sub-panel, and the conduit and boxes and just having the electrician do the terminations and final install.  I also installed higher gauge wire than I needed for 60 amps in case I ever want to upgrade to a higher amp service I have the ability to change out breakers and not have to worry about running additional cable (which with the conduit wouldn't be that tough, but for a few buck more, why not.   If you have a 60 amp sub-panel, you still have plenty of room to expand including 220 vac outlets.  

BTW, NICE Bowls!

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  • 6 years later...

Problem solved at my place. I know this is an old thread.  I had given up; however, a few months ago tried a newer type GFCI at the suggestion of my son. Hasn’t tripped since. Home Depot: https://www.homedepot.com/p/Leviton-20-Amp-125-Volt-Duplex-Self-Test-Tamper-Resistant-Weather-Resistant-GFCI-Outlet-White-R92-GFWT2-0KW/205997283

  • Like 2
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