New Year - New Workbench

[David Brown]

I am new to woodworking and so I currently do not have a bench.  I will probably build a simple table out of pine for me to use while I get started and figure out what I really need (and can afford).

[Al Capwn]

What @Immortan D and @sjk said. HF clamps are cheap, and see the video where @Marty Backe followed Paul Sellers advice and added wooden inserts into them to keep them from twisting (which, they will if you don't).

I would skip the threaded rod and either go with a wider boards for the top like the Nicholson style, or pony up the relatively cheap money for clamps which you can (and will) use on any project you make in the future.

[wtnhighlander]

You're going to have some extra 2x4 material. Use boards and some heavy dowels to box in your lamination, then drive edges under the dowels to clamp the stack tight.

[Robby W]

1 hour ago, SawDustB said:

 

I know this runs counter to conventional wisdom on this, but it also seems to me that using 4/4 lumber might make the glue up easier because clamping pressure could bring the joints together much easier than with thicker pieces.

I strongly recommend against using 4x4 lumber. Most of the 4x4's sold contain the pith of the tree, which is a recipe for serious trouble. I built my workbench top out of some straight grain Douglas Fir 2x8's I scored. I let them dry stickered and weighted in a stack for about 6 months, then ripped them down the middle and face glued them. Even with the 6 months extra dry time, the wood still wasn't dry, but the glue-up was stable and it has been a good bench top. That said, Douglas Fir has a tendency to splinter along the edge. That is really my only gripe. Pulling slivers out of your stomach gets old quick.

[SawDustB]

On 02/01/2016 at 9:43 PM, Robby W said:

I strongly recommend against using 4x4 lumber. Most of the 4x4's sold contain the pith of the tree, which is a recipe for serious trouble. I built my workbench top out of some straight grain Douglas Fir 2x8's I scored. I let them dry stickered and weighted in a stack for about 6 months, then ripped them down the middle and face glued them. Even with the 6 months extra dry time, the wood still wasn't dry, but the glue-up was stable and it has been a good bench top. That said, Douglas Fir has a tendency to splinter along the edge. That is really my only gripe. Pulling slivers out of your stomach gets old quick.

Just to be clear, I was NOT suggesting using 4x4 material, since I realize that most of those are just squarish logs pretending to be lumber... I was talking about using 4/4, ie: thinner stock that would be at 3/4-7/8 after milling. Where I am, I can get that thickness considerably cheaper (if I'm buying from the hardwood dealer) and it seems like it might be easier for the glue up, if a bit more work.

 

I appreciate the comments about the clamps, but I'm in Canada so there's no Harbor Freight. There are sources of somewhat cheaper clamps, but nothing like what is available in the US. I was looking on in envy through the black Friday sales, since the cheapest I can get 4 parallel clamps here is in the $150-$180 range (and even F-clamps aren't that much cheaper here). Probably a non-issue anyway, since I'm only looking at a 5-foot bench so I shouldn't need too many clamps to put it together. I'm intrigued by this suggestion:

On 02/01/2016 at 9:06 PM, wtnhighlander said:

You're going to have some extra 2x4 material. Use boards and some heavy dowels to box in your lamination, then drive edges under the dowels to clamp the stack tight.

 

[Robby W]

6 minutes ago, SawDustB said:

Just to be clear, I was NOT suggesting using 4x4 material, since I realize that most of those are just squarish logs pretending to be lumber... I was talking about using 4/4, ie: thinner stock that would be at 3/4-7/8 after milling. Where I am, I can get that thickness considerably cheaper (if I'm buying from the hardwood dealer) and it seems like it might be easier for the glue up, if a bit more work.....

 

That is what I get for answering when I am sleepy! I read 4x4 when you wrote 4/4. My mistake. Sorry about that.

Wtnhighlander gave good advice for making the clamps. You could even use 4/4 or 1x stock for the clamp sides, then reuse later. The wedges will also have the effect of spreading the force out. If you use thinner stock for your laminations, you will need more clamps unless you use thick caulks. The force from the clamps radiate in a 45 degree angle from the clamps.

[Brendon_t]

2 hours ago, SawDustB said:

Just to be clear, I was NOT suggesting using 4x4 material, since I realize that most of those are just squarish logs pretending to be lumber... I was talking about using 4/4, ie: thinner stock that would be at 3/4-7/8 after milling. Where I am, I can get that thickness considerably cheaper (if I'm buying from the hardwood dealer) and it seems like it might be easier for the glue up, if a bit more work.

 

I appreciate the comments about the clamps, but I'm in Canada so there's no Harbor Freight. There are sources of somewhat cheaper clamps, but nothing like what is available in the US. I was looking on in envy through the black Friday sales, since the cheapest I can get 4 parallel clamps here is in the $150-$180 range (and even F-clamps aren't that much cheaper here). Probably a non-issue anyway, since I'm only looking at a 5-foot bench so I shouldn't need too many clamps to put it together. I'm intrigued by this suggestion:

 

With a few 2x4's and some pre thought, you could pretty easily build a strong frame slightly oversized to your bench top then use wedges to clamp. 

Pipe clamps are a good investment, and will serve you a long time.  Harbor freight clamps are garbage no matter what you do to them short of total rebuild.   The spine is weak and can be reinforced but that does nothing to aid the screw being known for shearing the threads 

[Immortan D]

Yeah, like I said, pipe clamps. If you can't afford them, I'd reconsider my priorities. Instead of spending my money on hardwood for a bench, I'd build it out of plywood (torsion box, laminated, your choice) and save the extra money for clamps.

[Dknapp34]

My vote would be Roubo.  I can't say if its better or worse than any of the others, since I have never used any of the others, but I can say that I have exactly zero complaints with my Roubo.  It's big, heavy, has tons of holding power (especially with the Benchcrafted hardware) and I've never once found something that I couldn't clamp easily with either the leg vice, tail vice, holdfasts or some combination.  The only downside, as I see it, is that it takes a lot of time and wood to make, so I wouldn't recommend making a Roubo if you were only planning on using it for a few years.  

[wtnhighlander]

If you are primarily a machine-tool woodworker, the utility of a Roubo design isn't as important. Big, heavy benches like that shine the brightest when you are using hand tools.

[Al Capwn]

1 minute ago, wtnhighlander said:

If you are primarily a machine-tool woodworker, the utility of a Roubo design isn't as important. Big, heavy benches like that shine the brightest when you are using hand tools.

Very true, mass is geared more towards hand tool operations, and storage more for power tool operations. For me, I plan on working with both, but I am shooting for my workbench being more dedicated to hand tools (planes and chisels) and having my out-feed table, storage cabinets and whatnot be dedicated to my power tools. That is not to say I couldn't use a router or ROS at the workbench. Outside of joinery, I don't plan on doing much sawing at the bench, but who knows...things in life change.

[Brendon_t]

Ross, I know that is a popular saying but I can't say I fully agree.  Power or hand, everyone needs the ability to works faces, ends, and edges.  Everyone needs a bench that won't move around.

Power tool usage being my primary, I still need a strong face vise,  an end vise for holding stock while routing, cutting rabbits..

[Dknapp34]

10 minutes ago, wtnhighlander said:

If you are primarily a machine-tool woodworker, the utility of a Roubo design isn't as important. Big, heavy benches like that shine the brightest when you are using hand tools.

True, and I use hand tools a lot, so that could be part of the reason why I love my Roubo.  But I also find it to be well-designed for use with a router. 

[wtnhighlander]

9 minutes ago, Brendon_t said:

Ross, I know that is a popular saying but I can't say I fully agree.  Power or hand, everyone needs the ability to works faces, ends, and edges.  Everyone needs a bench that won't move around.

Power tool usage being my primary, I still need a strong face vise,  an end vise for holding stock while routing, cutting rabbits..

Not knocking the Roubo. Just saying that while a Nicholson style bench, or an MFT, or even a solid-core door on sawhorses can do a respectable job for power tool work, the Roubo outshines them all for hand tool operations, where solid mass really counts. If you are a Normite, working faces with a planer, edges with a jointer, and ends with the ever-present Radial Arm Saw, a bench of lighter construction is just fine.

[Immortan D]

Just now, Brendon_t said:

Ross, I know that is a popular saying but I can't say I fully agree.  Power or hand, everyone needs the ability to works faces, ends, and edges.  Everyone needs a bench that won't move around.

Power tool usage being my primary, I still need a strong face vise,  an end vise for holding stock while routing, cutting rabbits..

MFTs can be stable enough. Just look at Shane's bench and all he can accomplish with it.

 

[Brendon_t]

 I'm not saying a power tool guy can't use a roubo or should user a card table.  More saying that I think most woodworkers would benefit from a stable base with mass.   While plunging a mortise with a router the last thing I want to worry about is catching an edge and the router or workpiece going airborne because it is not adequately held in place

[SawDustB]

The roubo has a lot of appeal. Right now my planing setup isn't much better than a card table (work mate) so just about anything would be a huge improvement, but I like how open and heavy the roubo is. I don't think I could bring myself to just go with a plywood or less massive bench. I could see using construction lumber if I have to. If I can,I want to build a strong but smaller bench on the cheaper side.

This doesn't seem to be done much, but what are the opinions on going with a hardwood top but with softwood for the base? That might be a reasonable compromise for me in terms of cost.

[Immortan D]

Do the opposite. Replace the top at a later time.

 

[SawDustB]

Do the opposite. Replace the top at a later time.

 

Are you suggesting that I should make the top from softwood and the base from hardwood? If so, why? My understanding was that hardwood was desired for the top for durability, especially with dog holes, etc... Why would I want the base to be hardwood instead of the top?

[Immortan D]

Good luck

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[shaneymack]

Ross, I know that is a popular saying but I can't say I fully agree.  Power or hand, everyone needs the ability to works faces, ends, and edges.  Everyone needs a bench that won't move around.

Power tool usage being my primary, I still need a strong face vise,  an end vise for holding stock while routing, cutting rabbits..

MFTs can be stable enough. Just look at Shane's bench and all he can accomplish with it.

 

Ya but the difference between my bench and an mft is probably 400lbs.....

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[Immortan D]

10 hours ago, shaneymack said:

Ya but the difference between my bench and an mft is probably 400lbs.....

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Exactly. My point was that an excellent and fully functional workbench like yours can be made as a heavy "MFT", out of plywood and without the traditional vises, and completely different to a more traditional design like the Roubo.