dust masks / resperators

[treesner]

Hey guys looking for a dust mask for heavy power carving work and doubles as a respirator for finishing. 

The dust mask i researched and have been using for light tasks was this RZ https://rzmask.com/products/military-green-m2-mask?variant=23386314567 which filters down to .1 microns and i really like that it velcros behind you opposed to a strap over the head that is a pain with a hat and safety glasses. 

I found some old info here http://www.thewoodwhisperer.com/videos/dust-in-time/ his recommendations being 3m 7500 series because the release valve pushes air down not forward like most to prevent fogging of glasses and he also added the pink 3m p100 filter  to the top of the organic cartridge. he would remove the organic cartridge when only sanding and dealing to make the mask lighter then add the cartridge if doing finishing. 

Curious what you guys thought and also if there's anything particularly good for bearded folks 

 

thanks,

-chris

 

[..Kev]

The 3M with the P100 is the standard for filtering dust particles and the organic vapor cartridge is great for shooting finishes!  I've never had any experience with the mask you linked.

I will say that regardless of the mask you decide on, facial hair will render them nearly useless.  Regardless of personal reviews and manufacturer claims, you can not get a good seal with facial hair.  

As respiratory protection is part of what I do for a living, my recommendation would be a good 3M mask, appropriate matching cartridges for the work at hand, and no facial hair (mustache is ok as long as it doesn't interfere with the seal).  The one Marc is using is a good one.

When it comes to cost..  I'm pretty sure that the respirator is cheaper than a lung!   

[Curtis]

Don't discount 3ms full face masks. Especially for power carving. They are designed so the weight sits on top of your head and are actually quite comfortable. I find mine way more comfy than respirator with eye protection jammed under my ear protection. And the full face provides 100 pcnt eye protection. One downside is if your shop is hot. I have had mine for around 7 years and used to use when I was using a lot of chemicals on some of my artwork.  But love using it in the shop as well. 

[byegge]

The 3m mask that you linked works great. However I am wear glasses and the nose piece on the mask interferes with them. I can still wear them but the glasses ride on the mask itself which makes it a little more difficult to see. My glasses double as safety glasses and that may be a drawback for you. 

[freedhardwoods]

I used to deliver byproducts to a feed mill. There was a guy with a beard that worked there that had problems with the dust. He wore a full face mask with a filtered air pump as a back pack. The mask didn't need a good seal because there was always positive pressure. It looked something like this.

 

[Eric.]

8 hours ago, TIODS said:

I will say that regardless of the mask you decide on, facial hair will render them nearly useless.

I know this is your line of work so I hesitate arguing with you on this point...but I find it hard to believe that a beard renders them "useless."  I have a medium-ish length beard and my mask does form some degree of seal on my face...I can feel it as I breathe.  And I can tell an enormous difference between when I'm consistently wearing my mask and when I'm not...no woodboogers or sore throat indicates the mask is absolutely effective - at least to a certain extent - regardless of my beard.  Perhaps not quite as efficient filtering as with a clean-shaven face, but still far better than nothing.

[shaneymack]

I know this is your line of work so I hesitate arguing with you on this point...but I find it hard to believe that a beard renders them "useless."  I have a medium-ish length beard and my mask does form some degree of seal on my face...I can feel it as I breathe.  And I can tell an enormous difference between when I'm consistently wearing my mask and when I'm not...no woodboogers or sore throat indicates the mask is absolutely effective - at least to a certain extent - regardless of my beard.  Perhaps not quite as efficient filtering as with a clean-shaven face, but still far better than nothing.

I did a fit test earlier this year and the woman who was testing us said you will never pass the test with facial hair. Now does that mean it's useless? I don't know but i would rather have no dust going in my lungs than some.

As for the 3m masks, they might be great but not for everyone. I had a company supllied 3m mask for a few years untill I did the fit test. I could not get a seal with a 3m mask on my face regardless of size. I switched to a North and it passed the test.

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[wtnhighlander]

Eric, I think the "nearly useless over facial hair" statement is driven by the fact that it is practically impossible to pass a fit test if you have a beard. Where I work, fit tests are performed with an irritant smoke, from which there is no possibilty of cheating. I'm sure that superfine dust particles are in the same size range as the smoke particles. For years, our plant safety rules forbade any maintenance employee frim wearing a beard, as there are several areas they must work in, which require respirators. A couple years ago, we introduced full-face, forced air respirators that support beards. Now it looks like a Duck Dynasty / ZZ Top family reunion when deer season starts.

[Eric.]

I'm not suggesting that facial hair doesn't have some effect on efficiency, that would be ridiculous.  I'm sure the bigger the beard, the worse the filtration.  But I have empirical evidence based on my own experience with my respirator, and I flat out guarantee that it works to a fairly significant degree on my face, regardless of my beard.  I can feel the seal that it forms when I breathe, and I don't get the same respiratory symptoms as when I don't wear my mask.  Anyone who tells me otherwise isn't listening.

[shaneymack]

I'm not suggesting that facial hair doesn't have some effect on efficiency, that would be ridiculous.  I'm sure the bigger the beard, the worse the filtration.  But I have empirical evidence based on my own experience with my respirator, and I flat out guarantee that it works to a fairly significant degree on my face, regardless of my beard.  I can feel the seal that it forms when I breathe, and I don't get the same respiratory symptoms as when I don't wear my mask.  Anyone who tells me otherwise isn't listening.

Hahahahahah!!! LMAO.

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[..Kev]

32 minutes ago, Eric. said:

I'm not suggesting that facial hair doesn't have some effect on efficiency, that would be ridiculous.  I'm sure the bigger the beard, the worse the filtration.  But I have empirical evidence based on my own experience with my respirator, and I flat out guarantee that it works to a fairly significant degree on my face, regardless of my beard.  I can feel the seal that it forms when I breathe, and I don't get the same respiratory symptoms as when I don't wear my mask.  Anyone who tells me otherwise isn't listening.

Yes, you are getting some filtration.  You'd also get some filtration if you tied a t-shirt around your face.  Regardless, it's a false sense of security to believe that you're actually protecting your lungs.

Now, with that said, I'm not at work.  I offered my professional opinion on the matter.  What you do in your own shop is up to you.

[Tpt life]

Just to be clear, dust is not the only reference here. Finishing has also been mentioned. Kev works in poison gasses as much as he does dust FWIW. 

Aaaaand we simul posted...

[Chestnut]

It all comes back to lawyers and lawsuits. The mask companies can ensure your safety if you have a beard and the mask does seal. If brought to court, "well it filters most of  it" is not a valid argument. Look at it how you'd set up a shop is 80% of the big 5 tools good enough?

[Guest]

I wouldn't blame the lawyers.  

Eric - the larger particles that gets stuck in your nose, and those that you were able to cough up, were annoying, but probably not hurting you much, because you body was to expel them.  

The superfines that get stuck in your lungs and vapors are what kill you, and would not even notice them the next day.  Those things can work your way around beard hair pretty easily.  

So yes, with a beard and respirator you are effectively increasing your comfort.   But you are probably not keeping the super fine dust out of your lungs.   That stuff accumulates over a life time, not a matter of days.  

Does it matter much in a hobby shop?  Do any of use expose ourselves to enough fine dust to kill us?  I don't know.  I am lax about wearing a respirator (read I almost never wear one).  Stupid, I know.  But I won't argue that I am being safe.  

 

 

 

[bleedinblue]

Does anyone here actually know a woodworker who has contracted a serious illness from woodworking?  If so, what was their woodworking situation?  I keep reading the warnings, but I have failed to find any first or even second hand experiences (aside from Bill Pentz)

#canofworms

 

[Tpt life]

I don't know of singular issues but suspect compounding issues. Can we really point to cancer causes or only potential? Same way a table saw removes fingers. That doesn't kill you, but the stress can't help your heart. Dust in lungs would keep oxygenation levels muted. Add that to other factors and it helps more than it hurts. 

[..Kev]

6 hours ago, freedhardwoods said:

I used to deliver byproducts to a feed mill. There was a guy with a beard that worked there that had problems with the dust. He wore a full face mask with a filtered air pump as a back pack. The mask didn't need a good seal because there was always positive pressure. It looked something like this.

 

This is an excellent alternative for people with facial hair!

[Eric.]

Well fine, I'll concede the good points and stop arguing against the illogical ones.

But in the end, we're all hypocrites because I guarantee ain't a single one of us is wearing our respirators 100% of the time.  So beard or no beard is pretty much moot.

[ClassAct]

Anyone here do recreational or commercial diving? If so, you probably know the difference between a mask that makes a pretty good seal versus one that makes a watertight seal. I know which one I'd rather have. It's also tricky sometimes to find a mask that seals over facial structure, facial hair, etc. Keep looking and keep trying until you find one that works.

[..Kev]

35 minutes ago, Eric. said:

Well fine, I'll concede the good points and stop arguing against the illogical ones.

But in the end, we're all hypocrites because I guarantee ain't a single one of us is wearing our respirators 100% of the time.  So beard or no beard is pretty much moot.

I'm quite sure that some are way better than others but, you're correct.  Even in industry where I work it's not 100% even tho it's a condition of employment.

I will also be the first to admit that I'm guilty as hell.  The videos I've put out prove it.  Part of that is overconfidence in the new dust collection system!  Part of it is laziness on my part!

If nothing else, it's a good reminder that we can all do better when it comes to protecting our lungs.

[Minnesota Steve]

I have respiratory issues going back to college and being around a lot of 2nd hand smoke.  If I don't wear a dust mask when working with pine or walnut, I'll be sick for a couple days afterwards.

For me I just use a 3M N95 dust mask, the kind with the air hole(3511 I think it is?).   They're fairly comfortable.

I have a 3M respirator, but only use that when using paints and solvents.

[Marmotjr]

I use North half face and full face respirators and are quite happy with them. They are very comfortable to wear, being (I believe) silicone rubber, and I do recommend them.  They're fairly cheap too.  I have both Particle and Organic vapor cartridges.  And Yes, I'm a beard guy, and I will concede the lack of a perfect fit, but the particle filters are so easy to pull air through (as compared to the OV filters), that I have very little leakage around the seal.  When I do a seal test by covering the filters, the mask will collapse, indicating a tight fit, but I do feel leakage. 

This level is completely adequate for me for woodworking, but is no way OSHA or NIOSH compliant.    Now when I have my head down in a vat of bubbly angry HCL or H2SO4, I'm clean shaven around the seal.  My employer's interpretation of the rules says you can have facial hair, but the seal area must be clean shaven.  This has lead to one guy trying to keep the "full" beard, but still by shaven in the seal area.   He looked a bit weird. 

[ben_r_]

3M 7500 with P100 filters user here. Like the fit of the medium size. I dont wear facial hair though.

[WalterVandervort]

I found an article about the best face protection today. Please check here

[Martin-IT]

I used to use something similar to this: Anti-Fog Dust Masks (https://www.leevalley.com/en-ca/shop/tools/apparel-and-safety-gear/respirators-and-dust-masks/41726-anti-fog-dust-masks),  and the mask was too rigid to have a good fit for me.  I switched to Elipse Low-Profile Dust Respirator (https://www.leevalley.com/en-ca/shop/tools/apparel-and-safety-gear/respirators-and-dust-masks/74167-elipse-low-profile-dust-respirator) and I have been happy with them. Not much fogging of my glasses with them and dust seem to be kept away.   I like this video: 

I have no experience with the beard issue(6:50 in the videos for bearded mask).

I only used them for dust, I do not used lacquer, oil based, ... except in the Summer, outside.

And if you want to have your air dust filter be automatic: