Drywall Screws

[bgreenb]

7 minutes ago, lighthearted said:

No, I am asking what people use and why....

No you weren't.  If you had asked what screws people use and why, you probably would've gotten some helpful responses (and yes, some snark too).  But you specifically asked if people use drywall screws and then actually said you didn't see any disadvantage to using them in furniture.  I'm actually surprised you got any earnest responses at all.  I'm actually not discounting the possibility that this entire thread is an early April Fool's joke.

[lighthearted]

1 minute ago, bgreenb said:

No you weren't.  If you had asked what screws people use and why, you probably would've gotten some helpful responses (and yes, some snark too).  But you specifically asked if people use drywall screws and then actually said you didn't see any disadvantage to using them in furniture.  I'm actually surprised you got any earnest responses at all.  I'm actually not discounting the possibility that this entire thread is an early April Fool's joke.

and this is the problem with forums.

[bgreenb]

Just now, lighthearted said:

and this is the problem with forums.

Please elaborate.  You came to a fine woodworking forum and asked if people use drywall screws, and now you're upset that people jumped all over you.  I kind of don't know what to tell you man.  Clicking on the link in your signature, I can see you're obviously not a newbie, which is what makes me think/hope you're just joking around.  

[lighthearted]

thanks for all the replies.  I try not to use hardware, never mind screws in my projects.

One last questions:   What is the preference:  square or Torx (star headed)?

3 minutes ago, bgreenb said:

Please elaborate.  You came to a fine woodworking forum and asked if people use drywall screws, and now you're upset that people jumped all over you.  I kind of don't know what to tell you man.  Clicking on the link in your signature, I can see you're obviously not a newbie, which is what makes me think/hope you're just joking around.  

Lighten up Francis.  I asked a simple question,  and I'm not upset, nor do I think people "jumped all over me".  

This is a woodworking forum.  

[Llama]

If you're going to use drywall screws, you might as well put on your flannel and fire some brad nails in for good measure.

 

[Janello]

30 minutes ago, lighthearted said:

No, I am asking what people use and why....

thanks--thats a helpful answer.

 Oh, I thought you were asking why people don't use drywall screws, not what tool they use. My bad.

[wdwerker]

Check " Quickscrews"  for all sorts of screws. Drywall screws are thin and brittle. They have bugle heads, the underside flares like a bugle or trumpet. This head snaps off way to easily when used on wood. Wood screws have a triangular head. Some of these have little nibs on the underside that help the screw recess flush when you haven't drilled a countersunk pilot hole.  Most of the screws I see at the big box stores are overpriced and of a poor quality. Spax and a few other brands already mentioned above are much better. Square drive and Torx (star drive) are much better.

I have been using screws professionally for 40 years. I learned to replace the cheap screws that come with most imported (Asian) hardware. So I keep around 40-50 different sizes in stock. A good countersunk pilot hole properly sized is important to prevent cracking wood and stripping screw heads. 

[bgreenb]

24 minutes ago, lighthearted said:

Lighten up Francis.  I asked a simple question,  and I'm not upset, nor do I think people "jumped all over me".  

My mistake.  I interpreted "this is the problem with forums" to mean you were upset.  

 

25 minutes ago, lighthearted said:

This is a woodworking forum.  

Exactly. 

Either way, my point's been made.  I'm out.

[Eric.]

Here's the reason drywall screws suck for furniture (from a PopWood article):

"Besides being heat-treated at a higher temperature and being brittle, drywall screws have a smooth “bugle head” – a curved transition between the shank and head. This design is to keep the screw head from breaking the paper of drywall wallboard (the only true use for drywall screws.) In addition, the countersink of the drywall screw does not match the recess made when using a typical countersink bit.

Also, drywall screws generally have thin shanks equal to the size of a #6 wood screw and oversized heads that are the size of a #8 wood screw. The oversized head helps to minimize tearing through the drywall’s paper face as well.

It’s easy to understand that if you tighten a screw with those characteristics, it’s more likely to break when driven into wood. The bugle-head design doesn’t fit the countersink and the thin shank reaches a point of stress prior to the larger head being properly seated."

 

I still use them for jigs because who cares.  For furniture I like McFeely's or Spax.  Screws should not be used in furniture in any situation where they are easily avoided.  Attaching table tops and G&G/Maloof type joinery (where the screws are hidden with decorative plugs) are the only places I personally find them acceptable.

[BonPacific]

2 hours ago, lighthearted said:

One last questions:   What is the preference:  square or Torx (star headed)?

I like Robertson drive because they don't strip, and they stay on the driver if I'm moving around. Torx/Star are fine, but I don't find any reason to favor them over Robertson, and they don't stay on the driver.

I stock Hillman Group Square drive fasteners in a variety of sizes, with a few stepping up to the "Pro Crafter" line just because I'm often too lazy to pre-drill a hole when hanging something on the wall.

 

Here's a question. I hear a lot of folks recommending Spax screws. Are you recommending the star-drive ones? Or that Phillips/Robertson hybrid stuff?

 

[CandorLush]

The Spax star drive screws are like heaven to use

 

Fun Fact: Mr. Phillips didn't invent the screw, just patented it

[BonPacific]

11 minutes ago, CandorLush said:

The Spax star drive screws are like heaven to use

Do they stick to the driver? I've used GRK and Deck Mate star-drive, and find they don't hold to the bit as well as Robertsons.

[CandorLush]

32 minutes ago, BonPacific said:

Do they stick to the driver? I've used GRK and Deck Mate star-drive, and find they don't hold to the bit as well as Robertsons.

Errr.... I don't have any exp with Robertsons and I normally use magnetic drivers so everything sticks soooooo I can't compare them.

[lighthearted]

3 hours ago, Eric. said:

Here's the reason drywall screws suck for furniture (from a PopWood article):

 

thanks Eric!  Great info!

[Ronn W]

I was going to say something but.....Screw it.

[SawDustB]

This is one screwed up thread ☺. Seriously, I don't know why you'd bother with drywall screws when you can buy decent wood screws for only a little more. Unless you're using thousands of screws, they're not going to amount to any noticeable cost.

[Tom King]

7 hours ago, BonPacific said:

Do they stick to the driver? I've used GRK and Deck Mate star-drive, and find they don't hold to the bit as well as Robertsons.

The bit makes a lot of difference.  The GRK bits are not bad, and found in the box stores.  I like them also because they're color coded, and my helpers don't have to read what size the bit is when I call for one.  When one of my helpers first started working for me, he started keeping the bits in his pocket so he would have the one I called for.  I knew then that he would be a keeper.

  Dewalt bits are the worst , and other tool manufacturer bits are pretty awful with fit in the screw heads.  

[Tom King]

25 or so years ago, screws sold as decking screws were nothing more than galvanized sheetrock screws.  They snapped just as easily, and you almost had to predrill all holes.

[drzaius]

3 hours ago, Tom King said:

Dewalt bits are the worst , and other tool manufacturer bits are pretty awful with fit in the screw heads.

Milwaukee driver bits are quite dreadful as well.

[wdwerker]

I buy round shanked bits and slide a ring shaped high powered magnet over it.

[Chud]

If you're not going for square or torx drive then you should really buy and use pozidriv as opposed to phillips. Phillips screw heads are designed to cam-out when torque hits a certain level iirc they were designed for automated devices e.g. belt fed drivers - pozidriv (or variants such as prodriv) are designed not to cam out (although they still will if you're using an old worn bit).

Drywall screws are phillips as they are meant to cam out and stop driving in once the head sits slightly below the level of the drywall - you also use specialist drywall bits with a collar round them to assist this.

As far as bits go (here in the UK) your best bet is probably Wera - especially if using in an impact driver. Their bit holders are also brilliant and the impaktor bit holder for impact drivers is by a long way the best you can get to stop your impact driver destroying bits on a less frequent basis.

[Chud]

A bit off-topic but if you're ever dismantling something with slightly worn phillips or pozidriv screws and it's giving issues then ACR bits can be a lifesaver - they have teeth on the driver face that help to prevent cam-out. I used to have a set of Bosch ACR bits and I mourn their loss but it looks like quite a few produce them now including Wera. The link is a phillips one but you can get them in other drive types.

https://www.amazon.com/Wera-Special-Design-Phillips-Drive/dp/B00A8QW3YM

[BonPacific]

15 hours ago, Tom King said:

 Dewalt bits are the worst , and other tool manufacturer bits are pretty awful with fit in the screw heads.  

That might be my issue. I stock DeWalt bits, as their Robertson drivers fit very well, and I never expect much out of a Phillips. Given the tapered nature of the bit, it would be pretty much impossible to screw up a Robertson bit. As long as it's even close to square.

[CandorLush]

oh, Robertson is square, got it, I do like them and they do stick to the bit really really well