I'm building a shop!


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I’ve always had an interest in building, fixing and DIY.  Our family would spend 3 months a year in a very remote fishing village in SE Alaska, so maintaining/building/fixing seems to run in the famil

A little Christmas update... on Friday, the crew put up the wall purlins and also got the LVL's lifted and installed.  And last night it started snowing for our first white Christmas I can remember in

HA! Well, my wife got home, and sent me a picture of the last panel of the garage door going in, just as soon as I posted the last message.  The door matches those on the house.   

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Any overhead job is hard, no matter how you figure it.   Any time I do anything overhead, I tip my hat to Michelangelo, because nothing anyone has ever done since approaches the Sistine Chapel ceiling.  Everyone acknowledges that it's amazing.   People who have worked overhead, even for one day, or part of a day, have a much better understanding.

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5 minutes ago, Tom King said:

Any overhead job is hard, no matter how you figure it.   Any time I do anything overhead, I tip my hat to Michelangelo, because nothing anyone has ever done since approaches the Sistine Chapel ceiling.  Everyone acknowledges that it's amazing.   People who have worked overhead, even for one day, or part of a day, have a much better understanding.

The ceiling is reinforcing what I already knew: definitely a ton of respect for folks who can do precise, detail work in awkward positions, especially overhead. 

I meant to respond to your other post on the insulation earlier - sorry.  In hindsight, I actually didn't mind the insulation as much... it was itchy and uncomfortable, but the mask and gloves addressed most of that. The pain in my bad shoulder was, well, bad, but it was offset by seeing visible progress each day in the coverage of the walls and ceiling. I think that's what is bothering most about this weekend's work: We busted our butts, and only got halfway thru 1 bay... Not much return from our ton of effort.  I'm trying to remember that my day job is in IT, and I'm not doing construction day-in and day-out (so things will take much longer) but I really expected more progress. I suppose I learned a bit along the way, and that will help the rest of the work go more smoothly.

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On ‎6‎/‎22‎/‎2018 at 6:48 PM, wdwerker said:

Insulation and Sheetrock work is for people who haven't learned the skills to do something more profitable and less miserable. If you choose to do your own I understand, but would you do it for the going rate ?

LOL. I get it - especially the drywall sanding (we hired out our last big job with overhead mud and tape).  But in this case, we blew part of the budget on the site prep work we had to/chose to do, and as a result, I've had to make that up with sweat. 

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A quick mid-week update: after work this week, I managed to get the tall wall on the first of the 3 bays, sheathed with metal.  The j-channel around the windows look a little rough, but I really like the clean lines.   On the next bay, I'm going to try to line up and match the rib pattern on the ceiling (missed opportunity on this bay). Now I just need to get my Dad back down here so we can install the rest of the ceiling panels!  Casing the exposed framing in the window space is going to be a major pain though.

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13 hours ago, Firehawk said:

Hi,  Just curious does the metal sheeting substitute for a vapor barrier? I did the same ceiling in my shop and added one.  I am now wondering if it was unnecessary.

I decided to match our home, which has vapor barrier on the outer wall, and then insulation/framing, with drywall on the inside...  Our climate is fairly moderate as well, so we don't see the temperature extremes that other locations have. 

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FYI, metal will collect vapor under the correct conditions. If a vapor barrier is used behind the metal, an air gap is advised. I say this with IN experience where 90° at 90% humidity are common. The cool metal will condense the humidity just like the concrete will. Obviously in Tucson (where I am visiting family) this concept is completely foreign. 

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39 minutes ago, Tpt life said:

FYI, metal will collect vapor under the correct conditions. If a vapor barrier is used behind the metal, an air gap is advised. I say this with IN experience where 90° at 90% humidity are common. The cool metal will condense the humidity just like the concrete will. Obviously in Tucson (where I am visiting family) this concept is completely foreign. 

Yeah, I was torn on that, but based on the feedback from the builder, and other structures around here, I think we're set up properly for our location. 

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No need for a second vapor barrier behind the metal.  A very small amount could get behind the ribs, if they're open on either end, but I wouldn't think it would be much.  If they are wide open on both ends, then it would be better to have a backup.

All the shed roofs that I have metal over purlins only, drip water under just the right/wrong conditions.  Any built since the first ones get solid sheathing, and tar paper.

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3 minutes ago, Tom King said:

No need for a second vapor barrier behind the metal.  A very small amount could get behind the ribs, if they're open on either end, but I wouldn't think it would be much.  If they are wide open on both ends, then it would be better to have a backup.

All the shed roofs that I have metal over purlins only, drip water under just the right/wrong conditions.  Any built since the first ones get solid sheathing, and tar paper.

Thanks Tom. 

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Just a quick update - The boy's birthday was this week, and turning 7 is a BIG DEAL. :) So once the second party was finished (family only this time, the first party was for school friends last week), I ran to home depot for screws, and Cat6 connectors (gotta get set up for internet access too).  Then I got started (AND FINISHED!) installing J-channel all around the second bay. I also spent a an hour cleaning up a HUGE pile of insulation scraps I've been moving out of my way for the past couple of weeks.  

My Dad is coming back tomorrow, and we'll see how far we get installing panels in the second bay... The end is ALMOST in sight, which means I can do some woodworking again finally.  

I'll post pictures of tomorrow's progress.  

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Lots of progress yesterday: made a run to a different Lowes and bought all of their white J-Channel (I think I'll need another 7 sticks of this to finish up), and then get started on the first of the angled walls while I waited for my Dad to arrive.  I decided to install the bottom j-Channel after all of the wall panels are installed, because the angles are tricky. 

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Once my Dad arrived, we got started on the center bay... this one went WAY smoother than the first one, and it looks better as well!

We finished 8 of the 12 panels before he had to take off in the late afternoon.  Tonight, I'm hoping to have the wife come help hang the last 4 panels so this bay can be done too.  There's just no way I can see to hang the ceiling panels by myself, so progress is dependent on the availability of reliable assistance.

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11 minutes ago, Robert Morse said:

...There's just no way I can see to hang the ceiling panels by myself, so progress is dependent on the availability of reliable assistance.

 

You could rent a drywall lift and scaffolding! :D

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On ‎7‎/‎9‎/‎2018 at 10:34 AM, VizslaDad said:

You could rent a drywall lift and scaffolding! :D

I need a lift that will get the end up 15'... the ones at the rental place only go to 12. 

I've spent the last 2 nights getting ready for the final ceiling push. My dad is coming down for one last weekend, and we're going to hang all 16 remaining ceiling panels.  I've had some prep work to get done before we start on that: 

* I installed steel and J-channel on the top 6' of the wall section near the garage door, which was necessary in order to...

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* Install a shortened, heavy duty shelf bracket to hold up the garage door rail on the wall side. The bracket the door installers used was perforated angle hanging from the ceiling.  It blocked the window, and would have had to be moved/removed to install the ceiling panel anyway. This looks MUCH better, and is more secure and stable too!

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* Then I installed 2/3 of the j-channel needed for the last bay. Only  3 sticks left to finish up the ceiling, which I'll finish tonight. (no pictures of this...)

I've been hand cutting the rip cuts near ribs because the harbor freight power shears don't work too close to a rib, but hand cutting was leaving a jagged edge.  Because I got fed up with blood all over the panels last night, I went and bought a new best friend - this Milwaukee metal shear(s?) is FANTASTIC.  Much lighter, far quieter, and far less effort is required to make the cuts.  In related news, I can now make super cool metal noodles, and also the stock price of Band-Aids just took huge hit.

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I'm MORE than ready to be done with the metal work on this building... but the end is in sight. 

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3 minutes ago, Chet said:

Looking good.  What are you putting on the lower portions of the walls?

Drywall... I had planned to do ply, but I like the look of clean, smooth drywall better.  I will put a French cleat strip all the way around the top of the drywall for hanging stuff. 

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When cutting with snips, don't squeeze the handles all the way together with each bite.  In other words, the pointy ends of the snips don't come together, or even penetrate the metal surface.   Take as much of a bite as you can, without that penetration, slide the snips forward, and repeat as neceassary.   If you make complete cuts at each bite, you end up with a series of what we call "meat hooks".   The meat is going to be yours. 

I don't know if this was the trouble or not.  I use various shears and nibblers too, but when I want a straight, smooth cut, I use hand snips.

The same technique is used when cutting anything with scissors, that you can start a cut and just slide the scissors along.

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2 minutes ago, Tom King said:

When cutting with snips, don't squeeze the handles all the way together with each bite.  In other words, the pointy ends of the snips don't come together, or even penetrate the metal surface.   Take as much of a bite as you can, without that penetration, slide the snips forward, and repeat as neceassary.   

Thanks for the tips - I had been very careful about not letting the tips close, the issue I was having was some of the cuts were right next to the ribs, and the snips would get stuck.  Getting them unstuck would put a little wrinkle in the cut edge, that was extra sharp.  Also, reaching into the middle of the panel to do cuts was HARD.  

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