Dolmetscher007 Posted December 30, 2017 Report Share Posted December 30, 2017 I built a very Mid-century Modern "Bookcase." And I will be hanging it on my living room wall, using the french-cleat method, directly under my flatscreen television that is mounted on the wall. So it will be a bookcase that also houses my cable box, modem, and wifi-router. Yay! :-( The bottom of the television will literally only be 3/4" off the top of the bookcase, so I will be drilling a half-circle hole into the back edge of the bookcase, so that I can feed the TV power cable, and the HDMI cord into the bookcase where the boxes will be. I have a really nice 4-outlet extension box that also has two USB sockets. I'd like to mount it to the inside-right side of the bookcase so that everything can plug into it, and I can have a little phone charging station all right there. So... this concludes the woodworking portion of today's post, and segues into the electrical aspects. My house was built in 1950, and the electrical has only had minor upgrades over the years. There is only 1 outlet in the whole living room that is a 3-prong outlet. It is about 7 feet away from the television and where the bookcase "outlet" will be. The outlet extension box that I have, has two three-prong-plugs, and a screw, so you are meant to remove the face plate from an outlet, and screw this thing in over and inside of the existing outlet. I've attached a Sketchup file that I made to illustrate what I need to know. Image 1. is just to show you how far away the outlet it from the Bookcase. Image 2. is to show you how I would buy a blue plastic outlet box, and an outlet, and wire it up inside the Bookcase. (the three cords that seem to be cut in mid-air, are the three power cords from the TV, Router, and Cable Box. I just didn't feel like making the look real) Image 3. The red circle shows where I don't know exactly what I should do. The end of the "Outlet Extension Cable" could just be a male 3-prong-plug. But is there some product out there that would plug into both outlets, screw in, and just have an "extension chord" going over to the bookcase? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom King Posted December 30, 2017 Report Share Posted December 30, 2017 In situations like that, I have taken the baseboard off, run the wires in the wall through the middle of the studs that were behind the baseboard, an re-install the baseboard. For new outlet boxes in old wall, I like the heavy duty, blue plastic boxes sold in Lowes or Home Depot. Cut the hole for the box in the wall carefully, using a pattern piece of plywood that the box will barely fit in. Those HD boxes have an "ear" at each corner. Lube the little keeper/flapper threads, and don't over torque the screw. Surface mounting will work, but will you leave it there forever? What type of wiring is in your walls? Does it have a metal sheath over the outside? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolmetscher007 Posted December 30, 2017 Author Report Share Posted December 30, 2017 5 minutes ago, Tom King said: In situations like that, I have taken the baseboard off, run the wires in the wall through the middle of the studs that were behind the baseboard, an re-install the baseboard. For new outlet boxes in old wall, I like the heavy duty, blue plastic boxes sold in Lowes or Home Depot. Cut the hole for the box in the wall carefully, using a pattern piece of plywood that the box will barely fit in. Those HD boxes have an "ear" at each corner. Lube the little keeper/flapper threads, and don't over torque the screw. Surface mounting will work, but will you leave it there forever? What type of wiring is in your walls? Does it have a metal sheath over the outside? I don't want to get into, "the wiring in the walls." I know absolutely zero about electricity, and I'm fine with that staying that way. I am essentially just talking about finding a surge protector strip, with a long enough cord, plugging it in to the wall, and then screwing it to the inside of the bookcase box. BUT... I would be making the extension strip myself out of an outlet receptacle box that has one of these screwed in as a faceplate... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolmetscher007 Posted December 30, 2017 Author Report Share Posted December 30, 2017 I may pull up the baseboards, route out a little channel in the backside of the baseboards, and bury the cord in the baseboard, but I'm not going into the wall(s). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wdwerker Posted December 30, 2017 Report Share Posted December 30, 2017 Look into " Wiremold " metal chase that can be painted. I got a battery backup meant for office use. Power, cable, phone etc all protected from surges plus TV runs for about 1hr if the power goes out. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom King Posted December 30, 2017 Report Share Posted December 30, 2017 No need to worry about using a surge protector if it's not going to be grounded. A two slotted outlet does not provide a ground. If you change it to a three-prong outlet, the ground needs to be connected all the way back to the service. If the wiring in the wall is shielded with a metal jacket, the metal sheathing should be providing the ground. There may also be a third wire (ground) connected to the box, but not the outlet. If that is the case, the wiring in the wall will need to be accessed. Otherwise, forget about a surge protector providing any major protection. House wiring is as simple as it gets. Google "ungrounded surge protector", and you should find plenty of information. Here is the best conversation I found on the subject with such a search: https://www.cnet.com/forums/discussions/surge-protectors-in-older-houses-with-only-2-wires-384087/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isaac Posted December 30, 2017 Report Share Posted December 30, 2017 Would a product like this suffice for you? There are a number of similar options. https://www.amazon.com/Desktop-Grommet-2-Socket-Convex-Surface/dp/B01N531NK1/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1514670899&sr=8-5&keywords=Desk+outlet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wdwerker Posted December 30, 2017 Report Share Posted December 30, 2017 Buy a little 3 prong receptacle checker. It has 3 lights and will tell you if that outlet is actually grounded. Wise investment of $5 https://www.lowes.com/pd/Southwire-Analog-Voltage-Detector-Meter/50129728 The device Isaac linked to has a 10 ft cord. Is the 7 ft distance diagonal or wall hugging ? They sell adhesive mounting squares that would let you zip tie the cord along the baseboard. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom King Posted December 30, 2017 Report Share Posted December 30, 2017 The tester is a good idea. I would bet that someone just changed the outlet in the box though, and not run any kind of ground to it, since are the others are two prong. If you have a multimeter, testing from the hot slot to the ground will show 120V if the ground is good, just as it would from hot to neutral. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolmetscher007 Posted December 31, 2017 Author Report Share Posted December 31, 2017 3 hours ago, Isaac said: Would a product like this suffice for you? There are a number of similar options. https://www.amazon.com/Desktop-Grommet-2-Socket-Convex-Surface/dp/B01N531NK1/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1514670899&sr=8-5&keywords=Desk+outlet THIS... is 100% exactly what I was looking for!!! Thanks man! Jut as a childish... giggle... did you by any chance see the name of the company that makes that thing?!? Baah ha ha ha!!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtnhighlander Posted December 31, 2017 Report Share Posted December 31, 2017 Calm down, that's supposed to read " Kungfu King". Yeah, right. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isaac Posted December 31, 2017 Report Share Posted December 31, 2017 Haha glad it helps. Another option that actually appears to have a surge protection switch. I'd scan around Amazon a bit, you might find one in a specific shape and color you prefer, there seem to be many options. https://www.amazon.com/Conference-Recessed-Socket-Outlets-Meters/dp/B072FRLY77/ref=pd_sbs_60_5?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B072FRLY77&pd_rd_r=2KQD5D1WC8Z2X72Y36YM&pd_rd_w=Ox4Zi&pd_rd_wg=v8hj5&psc=1&refRID=2KQD5D1WC8Z2X72Y36YM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drzaius Posted December 31, 2017 Report Share Posted December 31, 2017 If you do decide you want things hidden, don't be tempted to pull the baseboard & tuck the cord under it. Cords are not rated or approved for installation in walls/floors/ceilings. You need to use armored cable or romex for that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coop Posted December 31, 2017 Report Share Posted December 31, 2017 5 hours ago, wdwerker said: I got a battery backup meant for office use. Power, cable, phone etc all protected from surges plus TV runs for about 1hr if the power goes out. That’s a neat idea to have the tv still running . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wdwerker Posted December 31, 2017 Report Share Posted December 31, 2017 Expose the cord and paint it or buy wire mould & paint that. Hidden wires in a baseboard could be dangerous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wdwerker Posted December 31, 2017 Report Share Posted December 31, 2017 2 minutes ago, K Cooper said: That’s a neat idea to have the tv still running . Neighbor was amazed from the flickering light coming through my front door and the whole street was dark ! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom King Posted December 31, 2017 Report Share Posted December 31, 2017 We have one of those battery back up suppressor things for the TV too. I've been surprised how long it's lasted. I remember buying it when a lightning strike did us a favor, and blew out the last CRT TV we had. I don't remember how many years ago that was, but the TV that I replaced the old CRT one with has since given up the ghost, and the one we're using now surprised me the last time our power went out by staying on. I just looked at it, and the brand is APC. It must be the longest lasting battery we own. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolmetscher007 Posted December 31, 2017 Author Report Share Posted December 31, 2017 58 minutes ago, wdwerker said: Expose the cord and paint it or buy wire mould & paint that. Hidden wires in a baseboard could be dangerous. Well damn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wdwerker Posted December 31, 2017 Report Share Posted December 31, 2017 Mine are APC as well. My brother bought a pallet load of old ones cheap. Gave me 2 of them. A couple years later this intermittent beep was driving me nuts. Battery was dying. Local commercial battery supplier had new ones for $25 each, gel lead/acid I think. It's about the size of a shoebox. New APC unit is around $85. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtnhighlander Posted December 31, 2017 Report Share Posted December 31, 2017 I have had dozens of APC battery backups, various capacities, go bad at my day job. They don't tolerate "dirty" incoming power very well. The best luck I've had to date is a unit from Eaton. But it is a 18 kva unit and cost about $24k. Size of a commercial refrigerator. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wdwerker Posted December 31, 2017 Report Share Posted December 31, 2017 Maybe the power from my residential EMC is cleaner than it is at your work ? Steel mill isn't it ? Just a thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thatCharlieDude Posted December 31, 2017 Report Share Posted December 31, 2017 14 hours ago, Tom King said: The tester is a good idea. I would bet that someone just changed the outlet in the box though, and not run any kind of ground to it, since are the others are two prong. If you have a multimeter, testing from the hot slot to the ground will show 120V if the ground is good, just as it would from hot to neutral. You don't need a voltage tester or multimeter to check for ground. All you need to do is remove the face plate and count the wires. Three wires it's grounded two wires it's not. Please turn off the power first for safety. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom King Posted December 31, 2017 Report Share Posted December 31, 2017 In some of those old systems, the metal box may be grounded, either by the metal sheathing on the cable, or by a ground wire being attached to the box but not the receptacle itself. In other words, there may only be two wires to the receptacle, and it stlll be grounded by the screw holding the receptacle to the box. This may not be the best ground though, since many times the connection is not a really secure (tight) one. It that case it could test as being grounded, but still it might not be a really good ground for the type of surge protector that dumps excess current to ground. Any ground is better than none though for most things. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isaac Posted December 31, 2017 Report Share Posted December 31, 2017 I've used this product before. Works well, and very easy to install, but does seem a bit expensive for the quantity you get. https://www.amazon.com/Wiremold-CMK50-Raceways-Management-Channels/dp/B0015EDVVU/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1514730551&sr=8-2&keywords=wiremold Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chestnut Posted December 31, 2017 Report Share Posted December 31, 2017 Raceway is a good ideal. I'd hide Ethernet behind a baseboard but never power. Also you can change out 2 prong outlets with GCFI or AFCI outlets and still meet code. They won't be grounded but they will offer protection. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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