blackoak

it pays to be april wilkerson

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I seem to be drawn to well produced video content , and I'm not sure why . I love Frank Howarth , yet I only use my lathe once or twice a year .I don't need to see another miter bench or Dust Deputy cart build video . Yet I'll watch the oddest things sometimes , knowing I'll never do that myself .I suspect lots of folks seek  "interesting" over "educational" .I do more and more .

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23 minutes ago, blackoak said:

I seem to be drawn to well produced video content , and I'm not sure why . I love Frank Howarth , yet I only use my lathe once or twice a year .I don't need to see another miter bench or Dust Deputy cart build video . Yet I'll watch the oddest things sometimes , knowing I'll never do that myself .I suspect lots of folks seek  "interesting" over "educational" .I do more and more .

I really like Frank as well!  And, like you, some of the others get tired and old..  There are some out there that I stick with tho and some that I move away from.  More for becoming a run-on sentence rather than doing something different and interesting.

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1 minute ago, mat60 said:

I just happen to  notice  that April is a hot topic here.

lmao..  Just leave it alone..... ;)

 

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15 hours ago, Cliff said:

I got no prob with her or what she does. I don't care for companies dumping all their products on people because they have a few hundred thousand followers. Another crappy version of advertising. And you are rewarding people for being popular, no other reason. It's easy to get annoyed when you see someone that is lacking in skill (whether because they truly don't have it or they just haven't had a chance to hone it yet) getting all the products when you gotta save up all year for them because of other life responsibilities. 

I also have issue with people that point a camera at themselves, slap it on you tube and make a living from it. Which differs from those that are actually teaching. I think our culture is infatuated with celebrities, and always willing to manufacture some more. 

You'll be glad to know that the viewership for woodworking content on YouTube has collapsed over the past year.  A few channels are still doing okay, but for the most part it's a post apocalyptic wasteland.   I've gotten a couple "free" tools over the years but it was never remotely close to what I put into making the videos.   

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32 minutes ago, krtwood said:

You'll be glad to know that the viewership for woodworking content on YouTube has collapsed over the past year.  A few channels are still doing okay, but for the most part it's a post apocalyptic wasteland.   I've gotten a couple "free" tools over the years but it was never remotely close to what I put into making the videos.   

Is this because of a lack of interest or do you think it has more to do with how youtube promotes content? I know my recommended videos page is filled with trash and if it wasn't for subscriptions I'd never get the content from the people i care to watch. The infamous algorithms have gotten so bad I'm on the edge of abandoning youtube altogether. I've also noticed that something changed and videos i watched years ago are now coming back to my recommended page showing them as being unwatched.

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20 hours ago, Chestnut said:

I think she's actually a pretty decent wood worker her audience just doesn't let her show it and she panders to the lower level that the vocal part of her audience is at.

She appears to make a conscious choice to make the projects she films accessible and entertaining to her audience. To say that she's "pandering" to lower level woodworkers is a less-than-generous appraisal, in my opinion. She's shrewd, found an audience that enables her to work the way she apparently wants to and live the way she wants to.  

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14 hours ago, blackoak said:

I don't know if Clearvue has ever made a steel cyclone, but giving one to April will get some eyes on it.  I'd love to know it's selling price

She does mention that it's a new product. 

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57 minutes ago, VizslaDad said:

She appears to make a conscious choice to make the projects she films accessible and entertaining to her audience. To say that she's "pandering" to lower level woodworkers is a less-than-generous appraisal, in my opinion. She's shrewd, found an audience that enables her to work the way she apparently wants to and live the way she wants to.  

That is essentially saying the same thing. To pander is to gratify or indulge. She touched on some higher level stuff on IG and it never made it to her YT channel. A lot of the IG comments were "I'll never be able to do that" ect.

You can believe it's a less than generous appraisal but she is in the business of making money and it's working. I have no negative feelings to her other than her offense at being told she has untapped potential. My less than generous appraisal is to the vocal minority that have steered a lot of content away from bettering themselves. I stopped following because she had no notion to move forward and I did, so i moved on.

If you want to know my thoughts on the creator type that do their craft to make money I agree with Ansel Adam's assessment in his  autobiography. It has a shrewd description of those that use their craft to make money and a comparison to those that practice for them selves.

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I think the biggest take away I get from watching makers like April is to not be afraid to try new things. Whether it's wood turning, welding, glass blowing...if you want to do it then just do it. You don't have to be perfect at something or have the most expensive tools to do, just give it a shot and see where it goes.

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2 minutes ago, Chestnut said:

That is essentially saying the same thing. To pander is to gratify or indulge. She touched on some higher level stuff on IG and it never made it to her YT channel. A lot of the IG comments were "I'll never be able to do that" ect.

You can believe it's a less than generous apprasial but she is in the business of making money and it's working. I have no negative feelings to her other than her offense at being told she has untapped potential. My less than generous appraisal is to the vocal minority that have steered a lot of content away from bettering themselves.

If you want to know my thoughts on the creator type that do their craft to make money I agree with Ansel Adam's assessment in his  autobiography. It has a shrewd description of those that use their craft to make money and a comparison to those that practice for them selves.

You forgot to paste the rest of the definition from google: 

Pander: gratify or indulge (an immoral or distasteful desire, need, or habit or a person with such a desire, etc.)

You may find it distasteful that a great many people might enjoy watching videos of shop carts and other less-complex projects, and that someone might find satisfying the desires of that audience a viable avenue for employment. I also don't believe for a second you're arguing it's immoral, but turning up your nose at her choices simply strikes me as bizarre.

Ansel Adams also asserted that he learned a tremendous amount doing that distasteful "bread and butter" commercial photography that enabled him to support his family. It rubbed him the wrong way because he wanted to focus more on his art. Nowhere have I seen or heard AW aspire to aesthetic heights beyond those that bring her enjoyment. To assess another person's potential based on how she or he comports herself in a contrived environment like online video sharing seems like a bit of a stretch. Her offense at suggestions of untapped potential make sense to me. 

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2 minutes ago, VizslaDad said:

You forgot to paste the rest of the definition from google: 

Pander: gratify or indulge (an immoral or distasteful desire, need, or habit or a person with such a desire, etc.)

You may find it distasteful that a great many people might enjoy watching videos of shop carts and other less-complex projects, and that someone might find satisfying the desires of that audience a viable avenue for employment. I also don't believe for a second you're arguing it's immoral, but turning up your nose at her choices simply strikes me as bizarre.

Ansel Adams also asserted that he learned a tremendous amount doing that distasteful "bread and butter" commercial photography that enabled him to support his family. It rubbed him the wrong way because he wanted to focus more on his art. Nowhere have I seen or heard AW aspire to aesthetic heights beyond those that bring her enjoyment. To assess another person's potential based on how she or he comports herself in a contrived environment like online video sharing seems like a bit of a stretch. Her offense at suggestions of untapped potential make sense to me. 

Ahh i guess i don't denote it such a negative emotion that you do. I haven't googled the definition of it.

I don't understand the apparent offense, the panderer is not to blame for the audience that keeps them oppressed. Any other time when someone lists an oppression of sorts the oppressor is the one to blame not the one that is oppressed. How is this any different. If her followers decided tomorrow that they wanted to see her make fine furniture she'd do it and be able to do it. Don't be offended because I am more optimistic of her work than most appear to be. Do be offended if you are the type that is critical of creators branching out and trying new things. I say this safely knowing you probably aren't that person.

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1 minute ago, Chestnut said:

Ahh i guess i don't denote it such a negative emotion that you do. I haven't googled the definition of it.

I don't understand the apparent offense, the panderer is not to blame for the audience that keeps them oppressed. Any other time when someone lists an oppression of sorts the oppressor is the one to blame not the one that is oppressed. How is this any different. If her followers decided tomorrow that they wanted to see her make fine furniture she'd do it and be able to do it. Don't be offended because I am more optimistic of her work than most appear to be. Do be offended if you are the type that is critical of creators branching out and trying new things. I say this safely knowing you probably aren't that person.

I better understand where you are coming from now. I also personally tend to get persnickety about word definitions and usage. It's a terrible familial trait.

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1 hour ago, Chestnut said:

Ahh i guess i don't denote it such a negative emotion that you do. I haven't googled the definition of it.

I don't understand the apparent offense, the panderer is not to blame for the audience that keeps them oppressed. Any other time when someone lists an oppression of sorts the oppressor is the one to blame not the one that is oppressed. How is this any different. If her followers decided tomorrow that they wanted to see her make fine furniture she'd do it and be able to do it. Don't be offended because I am more optimistic of her work than most appear to be. Do be offended if you are the type that is critical of creators branching out and trying new things. I say this safely knowing you probably aren't that person.

April is oppressing her audience?  Oppression is an act of control and cruel treatment.

(This isnt directed at you, Chestbut) I don't get these discussions about what YouTuber's get/make from their channels.  If you don't like it, don't watch it.  She (or all of them) puts out content that people like and she get compensated for that.  NBC, CBS, etc make crap scripted television so I don't watch it but I don't give two hoots that they make money off of it.  

Michael Bay, on the other hand...

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3 hours ago, Chestnut said:

I know my recommended videos page is filled with trash and if it wasn't for subscriptions I'd never get the content from the people i care to watch. The infamous algorithms have gotten so bad I'm on the edge of abandoning youtube altogether.

I agree with YouTube going downhill. It does seem that my preferred channels are putting out less content on YT these days, and are instead relying on other sources of income. I bought the Highboy Guild project with no intention of ever building it, I just wanted 10+ hours of quality woodworking videos to watch!

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Good for her.    

I do not begrudge her making money or getting free stuff at all.   I think she has earned what she has.       Making videos is a lot of work on top of whatever project is being documented.      In one day the cyclone video has over 111,000 views in a targeted audience.     A magazine ad doesn't even do that.

 

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49 minutes ago, TheAverageCraftsman said:

April is oppressing her audience?  Oppression is an act of control and cruel treatment.

(This isnt directed at you, Chestbut) I don't get these discussions about what YouTuber's get/make from their channels.  If you don't like it, don't watch it.  She (or all of them) puts out content that people like and she get compensated for that.  NBC, CBS, etc make crap scripted television so I don't watch it but I don't give two hoots that they make money off of it.  

Michael Bay, on the other hand...

Ahh see you have it backwards the creators are beholden to those that are most vocal in their comments section or their sponsors or ect.... The comment  crowd is not always a fair representation of the viewers of their channel. I have no ill feelings toward any successful creator other than respect for the torture they put them selves through. A good friend of mine that runs a linux podcast gets death threats monthly. Lucky for him he lives in the middle of no where and has his business separated from his personal life.

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3 hours ago, Chestnut said:

Is this because of a lack of interest or do you think it has more to do with how youtube promotes content? I know my recommended videos page is filled with trash and if it wasn't for subscriptions I'd never get the content from the people i care to watch. The infamous algorithms have gotten so bad I'm on the edge of abandoning youtube altogether. I've also noticed that something changed and videos i watched years ago are now coming back to my recommended page showing them as being unwatched.

I don't know which came first, but I think it's a vicious cycle.  The views go down, the content gets promoted less, the views go down, less content gets made, the views go down, the content gets promoted less...  But as far as my own content goes, I used to get maybe $100 month from my catalog of videos being recommended by YouTube, plus whatever the new videos did.  Now it's down to $20.  And the new videos get seen by a small percentage of the subscribers for the first couple of days and then that's pretty much it.  The last video made about $7.  It really feels like YouTube has turned off the water line at the main and I'm just pouring effort into a black hole at this point.  I've thought about turning off the monetization completely so I don't have to look at how pathetic it is, but it's free money.

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April strikes me as a real firecracker who can do well at whatever she put her mind to. So far that's not fine woodworking, but I'd bet there are a lot of egos that would take quite a beating were she to decide to do so.

I think Youtube has been in a gold rush mode, but now it's shaking out. I am seeing more and more "how can I make a living on Youtube" videos these days from 2nd tier creators in my various interests. I'm sure this must be tremendously disappointing to people who not that long ago seemed on a path to turning their passions/hobbies into their livelihood. I imagine it must be especially annoying if the people who seem to not be the best craftsmen are the ones who are succeeding, but first mover advantage, or clear exposition style, or ..., are all real things and valid explanations.

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What was the upside for Youtube to change these algorithms ? It seems it is to get content makers to create things that are simpler , easier for the novice to understand , creating more "views" .What led to all this ?

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