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pkinneb

Felder PCS® PREVENTIVE CONTACT SYSTEM

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Very cool. It’s nice seeing a different method than SS so that it won’t be killed/delayed by lawsuits. I remember seeing them tease this system a while back, but I’m glad this had more info about how the system works. 

It’s also very cool that it returns the blade to the same height after the trigger. 

Hope it makes it to the Hammer line. 

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Its going to be pricey whatever form it gets to the market in. Hope they can make it competitive with Sawstop. Looks like they are intent on building a wholly automated control system for the saw at top end, servo controlled lift and angle would be great for a commercial operation.  

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Man makes me hungry for a hotdog.... got one in the fridge for lunch :D

This is an awesome system, defiantly improves on what Bosch did let alone the sawstop system. The blade destruction and brake system was ok for a first iteration but I'm almost slightly disappointed after seeing this that Sawstop stopped innovating. Hindsight makes this seem like the next logical step.

I'm goign to continue to be irritated I'll never get a slider into my shop.... too big and too heavy.

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26 minutes ago, Chestnut said:

The blade destruction and brake system was ok for a first iteration but I'm almost slightly disappointed after seeing this that Sawstop stopped innovating.

Same here. I think developments like this will force them to come up with something better.

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I suppose, like any other new technology, it will take a while for the price to come down and for it to filter into the  part of the market where most of us live.

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2 hours ago, Jim DaddyO said:

Oh, you can bet Gass (inventor of SS) is working on how it infringes on SS technology.  He is a patent lawyer after all.

Any smart company defends their patents. No point in going through the time and expense of getting them if you’re not going to defend them. 

2 hours ago, Chestnut said:

The blade destruction and brake system was ok for a first iteration but I'm almost slightly disappointed after seeing this that Sawstop stopped innovating. Hindsight makes this seem like the next logical step.:D

Hopefully this coming out will spur some other innovation, either from SS or other companies. It shows that there are other methods, and potentially better ones still. 

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9 minutes ago, JohnG said:

Any smart company defends their patents. No point in going through the time and expense of getting them if you’re not going to defend them. 

Hopefully this coming out will spur some other innovation, either from SS or other companies. It shows that there are other methods, and potentially better ones still. 

This is true. The meat cutting band saw method is pretty interesting as well. It's been posted around.

If it were me I'd create a system that has a brake on the blade and then make the user dip their fingers in nano bots. Track the nano bots and when ever they get with in a 1/4" of the blade activate the brake. Only because nano bots and woodworking would be an awesome pair.

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6 hours ago, Ronn W said:

I suppose, like any other new technology, it will take a while for the price to come down and for it to filter into the  part of the market where most of us live.

i.e. the used market.  

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Sawstops patents start to expire in August 2021.  There is a possibility of them being extended to 2024.  There are about 100 of them.  They are written in the vaguest lawyer gobbily gook so as to cover the most area.  Still, it's only a matter of time.

I notice that Felder uses the term "reacts at light speed".  SS patents include a reaction time for the mechanism, so that is probably the reason.  They have tried to wrap up "flesh sensing technology" within their patents too.  So Felder may be challenged on that point.

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I wouldn't be surprised to see Gass file suit over the terms "PCS" and "Stop". 

I understand protecting one's intellectual property, and I have no issues against the tech employed in the SS tools. My only gripe is that Gass (allegedly?) lobbied congress to pass a law requiring flesh-sensing tech on all new tablesaws sold in the US, when he owned the only tech to do so. Effectively, he was asking them to grant him a monopoly and garanteed market. Not OK, IMO.

If someone knows this to be untrue, please set me straight.

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1 hour ago, wtnhighlander said:

I wouldn't be surprised to see Gass file suit over the terms "PCS" and "Stop". 

I understand protecting one's intellectual property, and I have no issues against the tech employed in the SS tools. My only gripe is that Gass (allegedly?) lobbied congress to pass a law requiring flesh-sensing tech on all new tablesaws sold in the US, when he owned the only tech to do so. Effectively, he was asking them to grant him a monopoly and garanteed market. Not OK, IMO.

If someone knows this to be untrue, please set me straight.

Did you catch the lawsuit in 2015 he filed against every maker of table saw for" conspired to boycott SawStop’s safety technology and corrupt a private safety-standard-setting process".

The original case and appeal were both dismissed. It was interesting though. He seems like he's more interested in doing lawyer things than table saws.

Just in case you missed it the above is a link to the US courts document.

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I just watched the video.  It really is clever, and a very different approach to SawStop.  I wonder if Felder's system would be triggered by wet wood or nails.  But alas I think that is going to be limited to high end Felders for the near future.  

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2 hours ago, Chestnut said:

He seems like he's more interested in doing lawyer things than table saws.

This is true... He never wanted to make saws, but Ryobi wanted him to be responsible for his technology in their saws. He said "I might as well make the saws myself then" B)... And that's what he did. The rest, is history :)

 

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38 minutes ago, wtnhighlander said:

I often wonder why the object always chosen to demonstrate the SS safety feature is a weiner???

Not sure, but I wouldn't stick my weiner in it as a test.

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1 hour ago, wtnhighlander said:

I often wonder why the object always chosen to demonstrate the SS safety feature is a weiner???

Because brats are more expensive?

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I think it was chosen for its symbolic value and the visceral reaction it causes in a large segment of the market. Either 'thank goodness THAT didn't get chopped off', or, 'Aghhh, I sure wouldn't want THAT to get chopped off'.

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