Capnrock

$1000 table saw

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Here is the rest of the story on each of Kev's concerns with the SawStop.

- Your aluminum miter gauge will trip the brake - Gauge won't damage the blade

    Only if you miter gauge is set up wrong and this is something you should be aware of no matter which saw you end up buying.

-Too much moisture in the wood will trigger the brake - Moisture won't damage the blade

   If you know you are cutting wet wood there is an override to de-activate the brake on the SawStop.

- An unseen piece of metal will trip the brake - Nail might damage the blade

   If your buying new lumber for your projects this shouldn't be a problem, and anytime you are using recycled wood you should check it with a metal detector prior to cutting it no matter what saw you are using.

I have had the the SS PCS  saw with 1.75 hp for over five years now and I am happy with it.  If I'd had 220 available at the time I bought it I would have gone 3 hp but I am happy with the one I have.

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I've had the Grizzly 1023 for three years now. I upgraded from a Delta contractor saw and have overall been happy.

Some things to consider are, how wide is the throat I have trouble getting my hand in to take off the blade lock nut and my hands are not that big. Do you want and need chip collection? The Grizzly has a shroud around the bottom of the blade.

I want to add that I am more than a weekend woodworker .

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I think you should look hard at the Grizzly 1023.  3 hp, very good fence and will be a lifetime saw. I've had mine for over 3 years, and find it will cut through anything you can bring to it, with the right blades.

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I've got the Ridgid. While it's been a good saw, it's not in the same class as the true cabinet saws. If you have the budget and room, I think one of the grizzlies would be a better choice.

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9 hours ago, Capnrock said:

Minus the flesh sensing technology, is the SS PCS 1-3/4 hp a better saw than the grizzly G0771z....meaning $1200 better out of the box?

Sorry $1400-$1600

I'm gonna argue with @..Kev about this. Only you can decide if it's that much better. How much is better build quality, fit and finish, ease of assembly, tech support, and quality of components worth to you? I looked at the Asian clones, of which Grizzly, Shop Fox and countless other house brands are, and compared them to the SawStop. It was heads & shoulders above those others and was well worth that additional cost to me. 

I also looked at Powermatic and it has very nice fit & finish, but there were a couple of things that crossed them off the list. Firstly, their integrated mobile base is just plain goofy and is prone to problems. Second was the snotty response to questions asked of the customer service about the product. Okay, there's a third, and that is poor customer service after the sale. Kev and I would agree on that one.

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6 minutes ago, drzaius said:

I'm gonna argue with @..Kev about this. Only you can decide if it's that much better. How much is better build quality, fit and finish, ease of assembly, tech support, and quality of components worth to you? I looked at the Asian clones, of which Grizzly, Shop Fox and countless other house brands are, and compared them to the SawStop. It was heads & shoulders above those others and was well worth that additional cost to me. 

I also looked at Powermatic and it has very nice fit & finish, but there were a couple of things that crossed them off the list. Firstly, their integrated mobile base is just plain goofy and is prone to problems. Second was the snotty response to questions asked of the customer service about the product. Okay, there's a third, and that is poor customer service after the sale. Kev and I would agree on that one.

No argument, just a different opinion.  I'll take the HP over the fit and finish.  I also think customer service/tech support are about equal.  

As for PM, I won't be spending another dime on the yellow standard!

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16 minutes ago, ..Kev said:

No argument, just a different opinion

Around here, 'argument' doesn't have negative connotations, as we are a genteel lot whom like to maintain a high degree of decorum :rolleyes:

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9 hours ago, Capnrock said:

Her thoughts are I bring a monster truck to get over a speed bump at the mall.

Wait!  Is there another way to get over those things?! :)   Tell her it beats driving around.

I agree with everyone above, even the guys who aren't agreeing with each other. 

I would have no problem buying Grizzly and have considered them with previous purchase decisions (though in the end I bought other brands).  There may be a problem out of the box, but I don't recall anyone ever complaining about Grizzly customer service making things right (that seems to be their business model).

I would also mention, if you have to add a 240V circuit consider that cost as part of the purchase decision.  

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All good points. Still a tough decision. At this point I think I'm gonna stay with 110. That might be against the grain for the forum, but for sheet goods, 1x's and 2x's I think I'll be fine. The harder species I'll just take my time. If I even use them. 

It's down to 2 saws at the moment

 

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Eric had a number of issues with his Grizzly machines & I think he ended up selling them all off. He seemed like a pretty fussy guy though.

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1 minute ago, Capnrock said:

All good points. Still a tough decision. At this point I think I'm gonna stay with 110. That might be against the grain for the forum, but for sheet goods, 1x's and 2x's I think I'll be fine. The harder species I'll just take my time. If I even use them. 

It's down to 2 saws at the moment

 

You definitely can get by with 1.75 HP, which is about the limit of the 120V (not 110V, there's no such thing) machines, but even 2X softwood, AKA construction lumber, AKA SPF, can tax it's capability. I had a 1.5 HP saw for years, then went to 3 HP & would not want to go back.

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1 minute ago, Capnrock said:

Everything so far seems to be Asian made. That's unfortunate 

Ya, get used to it B)

But seriously, let's clear the air here. Asian made can be just as good as the finest American or European machines. It's the American companies that import them, and ultimately the consumer that pays for them that specifies the quality of the build. They just build it like we tell 'em to build it. Cheap is king.

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3 minutes ago, drzaius said:

You definitely can get by with 1.75 HP, which is about the limit of the 120V (not 110V, there's no such thing) machines, but even 2X softwood, AKA construction lumber, AKA SPF, can tax it's capability. I had a 1.5 HP saw for years, then went to 3 HP & would not want to go back.

I'm certain I have 110 outlets, I'll be the first to say I'm not an electrician, but those handle 120v if I'm correct. Sorry for the slight confusion. I have dedicated outlets on their own breakers as well.

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I have the Craftsman version of the Ridgid 4512 that I got used with an upgraded fence. I like it a lot, but I got a hell of a deal.

If I was buying new for up to $1k I would be tempted to look at Grizzly. The Ridgid is now $750, up from $650 a year ago which was also up from $529 years ago. I would go with the Delta and a track saw if you'll be doing a lot of plywood work. Don't forget to set money aside for a blade(s).

If you're watching Craigslist get a browser extension that to alert you when new table saws pop up. Lot of stuff goes up and down real quick and I've been able to snag a number of things simply by being first.

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4 minutes ago, Capnrock said:

I'm certain I have 110 outlets, I'll be the first to say I'm not an electrician, but those handle 120v if I'm correct. Sorry for the slight confusion. I have dedicated outlets on their own breakers as well.

Nope, you don't. In North America, 110V went out at least 60 or 70 years ago. The utility supplied voltage is 120V. 

And just to add to the confusion, motors will be rated 115V or 230V, but that's another story.

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19 minutes ago, Capnrock said:

All good points. Still a tough decision. At this point I think I'm gonna stay with 110. That might be against the grain for the forum, but for sheet goods, 1x's and 2x's I think I'll be fine. The harder species I'll just take my time. If I even use them. 

It's down to 2 saws at the moment

 

There is nothing wrong with a 110/120v saw, I know a lot of people have their opinions on this matter but with the right blade for the cut you are making a 2hp motor is enough. Could the cut be faster with a 3hp yes but are you running a production shop? The proper blade is a low tooth count rip blade for rip cuts 30T for <1" 18-24T for >1". Though this should apply for those running 3hp saws anyway. Trying to rip 2" thick hardwoods with a 50T blade will cause more heat and the gullets aren't deep enough to clear the chips. Sure the motor can power through it but that doesn't mean it's the best way to do it. Honestly rips over 1" thick are better done at a band saw anyway.

The G0771 has cabinet mounted trunions, it's labeled a "hybrid" saw but it's closer to a true cabinet saw. A hybrid saw would have table mounted trunions and they are more of a pain should an alignment issue arise. I also agree this is a good buy. The 1023 is also probably a good saw (I have no firsthand experience) but the additional $700 could be put towards a good bandsaw. Also Sawstop may be the bee's knees but at that price point I'd rather have a European slider.

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28 minutes ago, Capnrock said:

All good points. Still a tough decision. At this point I think I'm gonna stay with 110. That might be against the grain for the forum, but for sheet goods, 1x's and 2x's I think I'll be fine. The harder species I'll just take my time. If I even use them. 

It's down to 2 saws at the moment

 

 

25 minutes ago, Capnrock said:

Everything so far seems to be Asian made. That's unfortunate 

If you go with the lower HP, invest in a good blade as that will help immensely!

As for the "Asian made", there are many different levels of quality there as well.  I agree with @drzaius that it's ultimately up to the companies who import them here for consumers to ensure that the quality is good.  I'll also add that the customer service portion from these companies should be nearly as important as the HP, fit and finish, etc..  I could certainly be wrong but, I don't know of any saws in this price point that are not Asian made.

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12 hours ago, Chet said:

Here is the rest of the story on each of Kev's concerns with the SawStop.

- Your aluminum miter gauge will trip the brake - Gauge won't damage the blade

    Only if you miter gauge is set up wrong and this is something you should be aware of no matter which saw you end up buying.

-Too much moisture in the wood will trigger the brake - Moisture won't damage the blade

   If you know you are cutting wet wood there is an override to de-activate the brake on the SawStop.

- An unseen piece of metal will trip the brake - Nail might damage the blade

   If your buying new lumber for your projects this shouldn't be a problem, and anytime you are using recycled wood you should check it with a metal detector prior to cutting it no matter what saw you are using.

I have had the the SS PCS  saw with 1.75 hp for over five years now and I am happy with it.  If I'd had 220 available at the time I bought it I would have gone 3 hp but I am happy with the one I have.

X2. I own the 220 3hp PCS and should also add that I have previously owned a Ridgid, and a Powermatic 66 both were great saws for me but the SS is by far the best.

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You can use their website to spec out the exact options you want and it will give a price. I think you can order straight from them. If there is a Woodcraft or other woodworking supply store they may be a dealer. I don’t know if these stores keep any saws in stock other than the display models or if they just order as needed. 

As mentioned before, you would certainly want to upgrade from the 30” “Premium” fence (it’s not) to the 36” or 52” T Glide fence. 

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34 minutes ago, Capnrock said:

So IF a guy was gonna buy a SS, where would be the best place to start looking. I'm only an hour or so from the Grizzly store which sells them too. Thanks

Around here, just about any store that sells woodworking tools & machinery carries SawStop. Prices are the same everywhere, so it comes down to location and customer service at the store. I got mine at Lee Valley.

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I had a buddy who had an accident with his ryobi portable saw and nearly lost his thumb.   More interesting was that even with insurance he had about $2k in bills from the hospital.

So when I went to upgrade my dewalt portable saw, it wasn't hard for me to convince my wife that the extra $1500 or so was worth spending.   I need my fingers for work.   it's very important.

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