Woodworker II Failure


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My wife purchased me a WWII for Father's Day. It was an ebay purchase, but the blade was still in the original packaging. Like a good spouse, she gave it to me early. I was pretty excited and put it on last night. I made about 4 cuts, all rips, last night. This morning, I went out and made my first crosscut and the pictures showed what happened. I have been woodworking for a little over two years and have never had anyting like this happen. I was getting near the end of a crosscut of 3/4" red oak on about a 4 inch board when I felt something hit me just below my sternum. It felt like I was hit with a paintball. I saw the piece of metal, a tooth from the blade. I checked the saw to see if something came loose inside, resulting in the failure. Nothing. I checked the board for nails. Nothing. I had the board secure, it was a cut free of the fence and I had a firm grip on the piece of oak I was cutting. The splintered end of the oak is a result of me jumping back after getting hit with the metal; I don't believe it is from kickback, but could be. I have had boards kickback on me before; I just don't think it happened prior to getting hit. Two teeth came off right next to each other. I think that it was a faulty weld on those teeth. I can't find the other tooth, I think it bounced of me like a springboard.

Does anyone have a different opinion as to what may have happened? What would you do in regards to contacting the company? I am not looking to get anything out of this, but I want Forrest to know that they may have some bad blades circulating (or maybe I am the one unlucky guy).

Oh, and a big safety point from this . . . this guy wasn't wearing safety glasses. I usually wear them. I was only making one cut and that was all I was going to need with the table saw. DUMB. I will never make a cut again without them.

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Yowza!! Without hesitation, I would contact Forrest and explain it to them. Send them to this link or send them the pictures. I am sure they can inspect and repair the blade for you. Not sure whether they will do it for free or if they will charge you. But you won't know till you give them a call. Shows how incredibly powerful these machines are. Glad the injury wasn't worse and hope heal up soon.

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It seems very strange that the blade threw the carbide tips. I think it is definitely a defect and they will probably send you a new blade like Marc said. I have never run into this before and I hope I never do. Glad to hear that you will be wearing your safety glasses next time. ;)

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I was trying out a new guy for sharpening on one of my Freud Fusion blades and he effectively ruined it. I wont use the blade again because his sharpening came across the top of the welds and I believe that has compromised them. Needless to say, he wont touch another one of my blades.

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omg my old Tsaw blade is quite dull and not worth resharpening and the WWII is exactly what I was going to get. Now I don't know what else to choose...don't wanna have to wear my kevlar frag vest just for this. What would be considered the equivalent? It has to be full kerf due to the saw's riving knife.

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FWIW, I had the same thing happen to a high quality Freud blade. Only difference was that I didn't notice anything unusual until sometime later when I removed the blade for sharpening and discovered that two adjacent carbide teeth were missing. I guess there are two morals here:

1. Such things can and do happen, even to the best of blades.

2. Wear those safety glasses!

-- Russ

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Without hesitation, I would contact Forrest and explain it to them.

I emailed them a link to this thread and my phone number. I expect I will hear something early this week. I will let everyone know what they do.

Were you using a blade guard?

It was sitting with my safety glasses . . .

omg my old Tsaw blade is quite dull and not worth resharpening and the WWII is exactly what I was going to get. Now I don't know what else to choose...don't wanna have to wear my kevlar frag vest just for this. What would be considered the equivalent? It has to be full kerf due to the saw's riving knife.

This must have been one out of a million that had an issue. I think that I would still buy another one.

Did the carbide fracture, or did the brazing fail?

It is definitely the brazing.

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If the blade was dropped in a past life this could happen, too.

I wrote up an Ask WOOD Q/A about a similar issue once. A fellow had dropped a WWII blade on their concrete shop floor and the carbide had crumbled off. They wondered if it was safe to continue using the blade.

When I talked to Forrest, they said that they would want the customer to send it in right away. They could repair the broken tooth, but they wanted to inspect all the adjacent teeth for damage as well. Carbide is pretty brittle, and they would be able to detect and repair any teeth that needed it. Also, I believe they wanted to inspect to make sure the blade itself wasn't bent. Forrest is pretty good about standing behind their blades and have reasonable services fees. Many of the larger manufacturers that I talked to only gave the option of "toss it and buy a new one." Not cheap.

Seeing as how this was an eBay blade, it's hard to know what treatment it received in a past life. But you'd at least get some piece of mind if you let Forrest inspect it.

Lucas

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Guest Screamer

That is why I am very careful when using my very old machine. The blade is new, but I still have this fear of the whole blade disintegrating on me whilst using it. That is my worst nightmare scenario. In your case I suspect a manufacturing defect. I always stand at the side of my blade when using it. It can be troublesome sometimes, but I think it is worth the trouble.......just in case. :unsure: You are very fortunate that the piece did not penetrate your abdomen. That would be very bad. :(

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omg my old Tsaw blade is quite dull and not worth resharpening and the WWII is exactly what I was going to get. Now I don't know what else to choose...don't wanna have to wear my kevlar frag vest just for this. What would be considered the equivalent? It has to be full kerf due to the saw's riving knife.

While I don't believe this is even remotely indicative of Forrest's usual quality level (I have had great success with their blades in the past), you might also want to take a look at Tenyru. Their Gold Medal blade is superb! That's what lives in my saw these days.

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I have a couple of WWII blades in my collection, one bought new and one came with the used PM2000. As the ts was in such good shape and I saw the fellows shop and how he cares for his tools and workspace I did not have any qualms about the blade. But your situation sure would make me hesitant to buy a used blade. New ones are not that much, relative to use and value. I would expect that this could happen to any manufacturer, but in general Forrest has earned high marks. I have heard of chipped or damaged teeth, but never about one being thrown back. Good to know the range of possibilities. Helps to reinforce all of those safety procedures. It will be interesting to hear of Forrest's response. Both in terms of customer service, but also just their take on what likely happened.

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But your situation sure would make me hesitant to buy a used blade.

I can almost guarantee that this was a brand new blade. The packaging was sealed and the blade had the plastic/wax coating on the teeth and the plastic wrap around the blade. If it wasn't new, someone sure put a heck of a lot of effort into repackaging it to make it appear to be in the original packaging. If it is used, I would understand this more. If it is new, I really want Forrest to take a look at it so they can determine what happened.

Are you sure it's actually made by Forrest? Might be a cheap import knock-off? I distrust eBay for stuff like that.

I am about 99% sure this is a Forrest blade. They would have to do some serious work to make a reproduction that is this nice (yes, nice; I know it threw metal at me). It cut like a laser and made virtually no sound when it cut. I was very pleased with it, until it tried to chunk carbide in my gut. It has the lasered serial number and all of the paperwork is from a high quality printing procedure; not a xerox copy. I will know for sure when I send it to Forrest.

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I have seen this happen countless times and with countless manufacturers both in table saws and circular saws. Sometimes it's the user's error and sometimes a manufacturer's defect. Definitely get it replaced ASAP as this can cause terrible things to happen to the user as well as possibly harm the saw. And...as always...wear these...safety glasses. :)

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omg my old Tsaw blade is quite dull and not worth resharpening and the WWII is exactly what I was going to get. Now I don't know what else to choose...don't wanna have to wear my kevlar frag vest just for this. What would be considered the equivalent? It has to be full kerf due to the saw's riving knife.

I wouldn't read too much into this....just an isolated incident that can and does happen to all manufactures. However, as much as I like Forrest blades, there are several that are very comparable. Infinity Super General, Ridge Carbide TS2000, Freud Fusion, and Tenryu Gold Medal (Marc's pick! ...note that the Gold Medal has an unusual mid kerf of 0.111") are all very comparable to the WWII...the Super General and Fusion actually leave a smoother edge and have less tearout in fine crosscuts and ply, but are a bit less efficient in thicker rip cuts. By including other manufacturers you improve your chances of getting a great deal on a premium blade. For a dirt cheap bargain on a dark horse full kerf general purpose blade, look into the US made Delta 35-7657 (formerly the DeWalt series 60 DW7657) from Cripe Distribution for $17 plus s/h.

Trevor - Definitely give Forrest a call.

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Scott - I'm not sure how wide the distribution is yet, but Tenryu now makes a full .125" Gold Medal blade. I have one in my saw now and it rocks the hizzy. Actually, the .111 kerf of the old Gold Medal blade is what kept it from being my every day blade. Was very happy to see them standardize it.

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Scott - I'm not sure how wide the distribution is yet, but Tenryu now makes a full .125" Gold Medal blade. I have one in my saw now and it rocks the hizzy. Actually, the .111 kerf of the old Gold Medal blade is what kept it from being my every day blade. Was very happy to see them standardize it.

Thanks Marc....good to know. Good move on their part IMHO.

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  • 3 months later...
Scott - I'm not sure how wide the distribution is yet, but Tenryu now makes a full .125" Gold Medal blade. I have one in my saw now and it rocks the hizzy. Actually, the .111 kerf of the old Gold Medal blade is what kept it from being my every day blade. Was very happy to see them standardize it.

hi Marc do you happen to have the part number for the Tenryu blade? I just see the .111 kerf for the 5/8 arbor in their web page

regards

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search for tenryu .125 on Amazon and you'll find a bunch.

EDIT: those blades are not gold medal, and the Tenryu Gold Medal blades that Amazon sells are not full kerf. Amazon used to sell the full kerf Tenryu Gold Medal blades - or at least I remember seeing them there.

You want the GM-25540-2

thanks Guys , I did not see it in the tenryu web page but I have found that number in a few online sellers

thanks again

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