Norty Posted July 6, 2011 Report Share Posted July 6, 2011 I was curious if anyone has ever broken a cleat with excessive weight, or more to the point, if there is a theoretical limit for the system? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carverken Posted July 6, 2011 Report Share Posted July 6, 2011 I have french cleats around my shop. I hung my old kitchen cabinets without cleat failure. The only failure was the cabinet. Not the cleat. I re-engineered the cabinets and have not had any additional problems. K Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Static_23 Posted July 6, 2011 Report Share Posted July 6, 2011 i have broken 3 cleats so far. im in the proccess of making a clamp support that goes out from the wall and not along the wall. so far 8 jorgenson parallel clamps are to heavy for the arms that i made. still working on a better design. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
konkers Posted July 9, 2011 Report Share Posted July 9, 2011 i have broken 3 cleats so far. im in the proccess of making a clamp support that goes out from the wall and not along the wall. so far 8 jorgenson parallel clamps are to heavy for the arms that i made. still working on a better design. Where did the cleats fail? Do you have any pictures of the breaks? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Static_23 Posted July 11, 2011 Report Share Posted July 11, 2011 No pictures. They failed right by the cleat but no glue and to short of screws will do that. Working on a better design because the glue and longer screw ones are starting to fail too. I have some ideas. I'll post them when I get it done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vic Posted July 11, 2011 Report Share Posted July 11, 2011 No pictures. They failed right by the cleat but no glue and to short of screws will do that. Working on a better design because the glue and longer screw ones are starting to fail too. I have some ideas. I'll post them when I get it done. I've never used glue and never had a failure. I have about six parallel clamps per arm coming out. I do use pan head screws into studs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Static_23 Posted July 11, 2011 Report Share Posted July 11, 2011 Well the cleat on the wall is fine. The arm is what's failing. I have my clamps coming straight off the wall not along the wall. So I just have to put some gussets. right now I am just using a 2x4. Might have to go to A 2x6 or 2x8. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChetlovesMer Posted July 11, 2011 Report Share Posted July 11, 2011 Every shop I've ever had has used the French cleat system. All I did is rip some construction grade 3/4" plywood into 6" wide strips with the table saw blade set at 45 degrees. I put two 3" drywall screws into each stud. I do this at 2 sometimes 3 different heights around the shop and ta-da! I've hung several hundred pound cabinets made from 3/4" MDF and stuffed with tools on these. I even used to have a sliding compound miter saw station cantilevered off these cleats and never had a problem. My method is super-cheap and couldn’t be easier to execute. It has never failed even under extreme weights. Once I built a ridiculously heavy cabinet that spanned over two sets of cleats, but even that one would have probably been okay on one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vic Posted July 11, 2011 Report Share Posted July 11, 2011 Well the cleat on the wall is fine. The arm is what's failing. I have my clamps coming straight off the wall not along the wall. So I just have to put some gussets. right now I am just using a 2x4. Might have to go to A 2x6 or 2x8. I'll try to remember to post a photo of my clamp storage tonight. Very simple with pocket screws. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norty Posted July 12, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 12, 2011 Interesting to read..it's reassuring. I would like to see some pictures however. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vic Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 Although the positioning is now different and I have quite a few more clamps, here is what I had at the time. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Static_23 Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 Although the positioning is now different and I have quite a few more clamps, here is what I had at the time. that looks a lot better than what i've got going. i'll give it a try. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juicegoose Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 Anytime I have to take a support out from the wall and I'm using my french cleats I always mount the arm to the top of the cleat instead of screwing it in the side. You'll get more holding power out of your screws by screwing the arm from the top down into the cleat. Not a whole lot of holding power in a screw on pulling force like whats shown in the above picture. Also the male portion of the cleat in the above picture seems to be a little wide. I typically don't make my cleats any wider then about 2" and thats rare. A french cleats strength is in it's downward holding ability not it's ability to hold things from pulling out from the wall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vic Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 Anytime I have to take a support out from the wall and I'm using my french cleats I always mount the arm to the top of the cleat instead of screwing it in the side. You'll get more holding power out of your screws by screwing the arm from the top down into the cleat. Not a whole lot of holding power in a screw on pulling force like whats shown in the above picture. Also the male portion of the cleat in the above picture seems to be a little wide. I typically don't make my cleats any wider then about 2" and thats rare. A french cleats strength is in it's downward holding ability not it's ability to hold things from pulling out from the wall. I did it this way simply because it is easy to do and the width of everything is an even number into a 4x8 sheet of plywood. I can hang my body weight off these with no problem and have only used the pocket screw and a little glue. Sometimes no glue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juicegoose Posted July 14, 2011 Report Share Posted July 14, 2011 I did it this way simply because it is easy to do and the width of everything is an even number into a 4x8 sheet of plywood. I can hang my body weight off these with no problem and have only used the pocket screw and a little glue. Sometimes no glue. Vic I'm guessing you mean that by hanging your body off of the cleats you mean off the cleat that is attached to the wall. If not and your talking about the clamp racks you created then kudos sir. I was simply stating for the poster that was having problems with breakage that in my experience with cleats the smaller the cleat that you slide into the wall mounted cleat the better(within reason. All for the reason I stated above. Your Idea for incorporating a gusset into your arm is right on. That takes the stress of the two screws on each arm and back on the cleat where it belongs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norty Posted July 14, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 14, 2011 Although the positioning is now different and I have quite a few more clamps, here is what I had at the time. I do see the benefit here of having the supporting legs disbursing the load. Neat design. Thanks Vic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vic Posted July 15, 2011 Report Share Posted July 15, 2011 I have everything hung off the wall as much as possible, as I either want cabinet bottoms to be fully enclosed or not be on the ground at all. This is simply because I'm a bit OCD and hate a dirty shop, which at the moment is what I have. Now these I wouldn't put all my weight on, but I built them with the idea that I'm never going to stand on them. Also they are not only on a cleat, but also the top part that slides into the cleat is screwed to the wall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slick218 Posted July 21, 2011 Report Share Posted July 21, 2011 If I were to do french cleats, I would use only hardwood like maple for both parts. Especially for kitchen cabinets (but why use french cleats when you can have a stronger joint by using nailers/hitting studs with screws) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beechwood Chip Posted July 21, 2011 Report Share Posted July 21, 2011 If I were to do french cleats, I would use only hardwood like maple for both parts. Especially for kitchen cabinets (but why use french cleats when you can have a stronger joint by using nailers/hitting studs with screws) It's easier to level and install a strip of wood, and then hang the cabinets on it, than to level and install a heavy, bulky cabinet. I've used pine successfully for french cleats, and I wouldn't hesitate to use plywood. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juicegoose Posted July 22, 2011 Report Share Posted July 22, 2011 Like my earlier post, the strength of a cleat is it's resistance to gravity(downward force) not lateral force. Put in a lower brace to keep the cleat from rotating and you'll be good to take anything away from the wall. Might help the original poster with the screws coming loose. After I bought a lot of those plastic foldable saw horses I wanted to get them out of the way. I had some room at the front of my garage between the garage door and wall..PERFECT. Obviously i needed to put in a lower brace so the cleat wouldn't pull off the wall. This was made with some scraps. It works great and holds 6 of the saw horses. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duckkisser Posted July 22, 2011 Report Share Posted July 22, 2011 so what is better cleats or peg board. my school shop has tons of peg boards on the wall. should i see about replacing it all with cleats? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texfire Posted July 22, 2011 Report Share Posted July 22, 2011 My opinion? French cleats are better. You can hang cabinets and other heavier objects on them that would stress pegboard. Then you take some pegboard, put cleats on it and hang it on the wall cleat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southwood Posted July 22, 2011 Report Share Posted July 22, 2011 so what is better cleats or peg board. my school shop has tons of peg boards on the wall. should i see about replacing it all with cleats? Actually, I would go with a bit of both. it is just not feasible to make the small holders to match a french cleat when peg board will do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vic Posted July 23, 2011 Report Share Posted July 23, 2011 I agree with Tex and Southwood. I keep all my smaller stuff in drawers, but if you don't have the drawer space, then a combination is best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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