Victorian style

[Beechwood Chip]

Marc has talked some about the design elements that make up the Greene and Greene style, and he's also talked about mission style, Shaker style, and a few others. I think I have a sense how to take a basic design and "make it Greene and Greene".

I have a Victorian house (1880s Italianate, I'm told), and I'd like to make furniture with Victorian elements. The problem is, I usually know Victorian when I see it, but I don't know how to make a piece "look Victorian". I've Googled some images of Victorian stuff, but I'm just not getting it. I suspect that if I read a book on Victorian furniture it still won't say, "this is what you do to make a piece Victorian."

What I'd love to see is a basic design, with "if you want it to look Victorian add these features."

As far as my house is concerned I've noticed that nearly everything has a triple or quintuple bead on it. So, I guess I can just put a triple bead on everything I do and call it done. But there are times where I'd like another option.

Wikipedia just told me that "Queen Anne revival" counts as Victorian, and Charles Neal does some Queen Anne stuff, so I can look there. I like Queen Anne stuff, but it doesn't look easy to make. Is there such a thing as "simple Victorian"?

Any advice? Thanks!

[nateswoodworks]

I don't really think any Victorian, Queen Anne, or the rest from that era are going to be easy to make-if you do it right and true. There are tons of books out there but I haven't seen one that gives "if you want it to look Victorian add these features" that you want. I have spent a lot of time in Barnes and Noble (until my wife is done shopping and comes back to get me)looking throught books getting that feel like you are talking about. I have American Furniture of the 18th Century by Jeffery Greene (linked below)that does go into detail about aspects and elements that set apart the styles of William and Mary, Queen Anne, Jacobean, Early Victorian; plus a bunch more. The thing I like about this book is it explains the details and has lots of pics to really show you the differences, some very little some very big. Most of the other books I have touch here and there on the Victorian style but I have seen a few at B&N and other book stores that went into detail and I really liked them but the cost of books add up quick!! Another one that I wrote the name down as a future book to buy is Victorian Detail: A Working Dictionary, but after being on my long "to get list" in my wallet for who knows how long I can't read the author's name and it didn't come up on a search either. I was very lucky a while back, my wife took care of an elderly lady and I did maintenance on the house, a beautiful home filled with very high end Victorian furniture that they let me have a hay day drooling over and taking pics any time I chose to. That was the best thing for me, seeing it in person and being able to look and study the details. My best suggestion is to hit a bookstore and a museum if you can, I know this didn't really answer your question but it is the best I can do. Please let me know if you find a good book this subject.

Good luck

Nate

http://search.barnesandnoble.com/American-Furniture-of-the-18th-Century/Jeffrey-P-Greene/e/9781561581047/?itm=21&USRI=american+furniture+of+the+18th+century

[adamking]

Hey Beechwood,

Victorian was more of an era than a style. Only later have we come to define it as a type of style. The reason you're not finding definitive works on it is because it was mostly haphazardly designed pieces that made ornamentation the focal point. The idea of the time was to keep the appearance of wealth. Every corner of a Victorian house would be chocked full of pieces and accessories, all designed to give the impression of elaborate wealth. (Oddly enough, this mentality helped fuel the Arts and Crafts movement that did indeed form several distinctive styles.)

Almost all of Victorian Era furniture was mass produced in factories and not well built. I've repaired hundreds of pieces, exposing the construction methods and revealing the true nature of that era.

If you want to make pieces to fit a Victorian house, then really, your best reference tools will be the actual pieces themselves. Auctions, antiques stores, and Grandma's basement all seem to be popular locations to find furniture from this time.

Good luck, and show us some pics when you make them.

[Beechwood Chip]

... it was mostly haphazardly designed pieces that made ornamentation the focal point.

Yeah, that's pretty much the conclusion that I've come up with. Actually, I figure that the current Guild Build is a good example. You take a basic dresser, and Marc shows how to put in some contemporary curves, and Charles Neil shows how to make it Victorian-ish. I just need to practice making scroll patterns. Charles makes it look easy, but I know from experience how easy it is to make something that just looks wrong.

Charles Neil also has a YouTube video on making a scroll pattern, and I've got his pie-crust table video. (Now, that's an amazing project.)

I've also got a bunch of furniture I inherited, that I can get ideas from.

Thanks for the advice!

[JimLewis]

This type of talk reminds me of the Miami hotel owner of the seventies. Someone asked him how he did in the last hurricane, and he replied, "Not too bad. Some of the architecture blew off, but that's about it."

If you want to do nice stuff, it's not a matter of slapping on some details, you have to settle into the mindset of the original builders and understand wood through their tools and techniques. Victorian tends to the complex, and if you think the furniture is bad you should see how they decorated— goopey on top of goopey! And then a fancy lace throw with an antimacassar on top of that, and some garish lamps and bowls to boot.

You have a some options. One is to build your own furniture in a complimentary style— simple modern with nice grain often shows well against the more complex Victorian. They were flamboyant, don't go lame and do something half cocked. All the way or nothing. You could start simple with bookcases, for instance, that put the details into trim, a crest, or carved feet. See if you can find pictures— any libraries near you have Wallace Nutting, or older stylebooks?

Another approach to learning is to repair/replace architectural woodwork in your house. As you rebuild things you will get a sense of how they used to work. And they worked well— this was the golden age of woodworking. There's an 1850's early Victorian town house near me that has curved, angled raised panels going up the stairs. Still haven't figured how they made so many so well without a shaper and a curved panel jig, and even then! But don't start there— knock off an entry door or a corbelled cornice and you will see what they did with stacks of wood, cutting a layer to expose the next, bevelling and adding detail, etc. It will up your game, and you have a full size template to work from.

As to Victorian being crap— get some better antiques. Much was mass market junk, but that's like saying contemporary is worthless because you've repaired Ikea or even Ethan Allen. They aren't Stickley or Harden for sure, and those two don't compare to an experienced high end studio furniture builder. My town was last wealthy in the 1880's. We had Elijah Galusha carving ornate rosewood chairs in the 1850's-70's. A friend found (in the alley) a pair of Egyptian Revival barrel style chairs, carved and shaped and turned like you would not believe. I've seen Rococo Revival bedroom sets that would make you cry— so beautiful, so stately and powerful yet a double bed was standard and converting to queen is well nigh impossible because of the curved veneered bedframe corners with wavy moldings tracing over them. And yes, our antiques stores are also filled with $300 flimsy mass market dressers from the late Victorian (1880's-90's), the bottoms of the drawers and inside of the carcases roughsawn, the veneers mismatched or poorly chosen.

Jimbo

[bois]

The best book I've found on the entire progression of 18th century furniture is American Furniture of the 18th Century: History, Technique, and Structure. This book gives a great history of how the different styles of the 18th century came about, the construction techniques, and perhaps most to the point of the initial question, the design elements that make up each style.

[Beechwood Chip]

Thanks for the recommendations! I'll add them to my Amazon list. Remember when you buy from Amazon, if you buy through a WoodWhisperer link it helps support Marc and doesn't cost you anything.