Liability and selling wooden lamps and shades

[WoodLight]

I'm curious if any of you have experience or advice on selling shop-made lamps and light designs in retail stores and galleries - or online and at shows, for that matter.

Among the things I make are wooden lamps. I do not simply build a lamp base and add a commercially available shade to it. I make the shades from papers, wood, wood veneers, with wood frames and the lamps themselves are sometimes incorporated into furniture.

My main concerns are liability issues and making sure that potential vendors have the assurance of safety and freedom from liability. I have confidence in the safety of my designs, as I've used them for years myself with no issues, but I have never sold any of these. The marketplace and regulations seem to add a layer of complexity when lighting is concerned. I can sell shelves, tables, benches, etc. without worrying about these issues - but lamps seem daunting.

Does anyone have experience with Underwriters Laboratories? http://www.ul.com/global/eng/pages/offerings/industries/lighting/ Though I have some designs that might be turned into small production runs and it might make sense to get UL "approval" for these designs, there are also one-off designs for which this doesn't seem practical. How does UL work? And are there other options to address safety and liability issues with small-run or bespoke wooden lamps? How much is necessary?

As I understand it, one of the main things that UL will look at - besides wiring - is the temperature that a shade reaches when a light has been on over a long period of time. Can you recommend any resources where I can learn about UL standards or similar standards in more detail? The UL site doesn't make their standards readily accessible - or at least I've had a hard time finding them.

Any experience/suggestions to share with a guy looking to sell some of his wooden lamps?

[areynoldsre]

I had some experience with UL back when I was doing computer hardware for a living. Even for a professional electrical engineer the UL regulations and requirements are confusing at best. We had a product that we thought would be a slam-dunk for UL listing and it was rejected before they started the tests (we’d filled out the application form wrong - we said it was a computer, they said otherwise and refused to test). We ended up having to hire a consultant that specialized in getting products tested by UL and other agencies to appeal the decision and get the testing done. Best money we ever spent - several thousand as I recall.

Being UL listed doesn’t release you from liability. It reduces the risk by having an independent test before you sell but a good lawyer looking to get your money in a liability lawsuit will blow past the UL listing six months before you get to court (step one, show that the testing was faulty or incomplete - very easy to do for a motivated law firm).

If you’re concerned about product liability, you need to consult with a good product liability lawyer, get plenty of insurance and hire a consultant to help you get through the various UL and government regs. It’s not really a DIY thing.

[WoodLight]

Andrew,

Thanks for this info and perspective. You definitely confirmed some of my suspicions about UL. I was beginning to suspect that UL was not the way for me to go, unless I'm doing some pretty large production runs. This is definitely not my intent - at least not in the foreseeable future.

I guess I'm not so much concerned about product liability as I am in trying to make sure when I approach potential resellers that - if they're concerned about these kinds of issues - I have some perspective or assurance to offer them.

I guess I'm wondering if anyone out there has sold lamps or lighting in the past and whether this sort of concern has ever been an issue. If so, how have you dealt with it? I've seen plenty of lamps on furniture maker's websites, so I'm wondering if others have even had to deal with this issue or, perhaps, it's been a non-issue? I know that when friends and family have seen my lights, it's not uncommon for someone to eventually ask about safety and liability, so I'd expect that resellers or individual buyers might have some of the same questions. Perhaps my family and friends are just excessively inquisitive?

Anyone had experience in this realm?

[TRBaker]

WoodLight, the only experience I've ever had with UL was when I was production supervisor for General Elevator Corp. in Orlando. We had to have a fire door tested, at their facility in Chicago (I think) and just the test was ten grand. We also had to provide a mason and iron worker from the local union to build a mock wall, and then install our door and jamb. Prior to this, we had to have our production process documented by one of their reps and afterward had periodic inspections of our facility and process to make sure we were still in compliance.

As far as your lamps are concerned, I do believe that you can purchase UL approved lamp kits from hobby suppliers, etc. The fastest way to get a good answer on this is to talk to your insurance agent about writing a product liability policy. He'll tell you real quick what his underwriters would require.

[jHop]

I second the kit. My understanding (and I'm not going to say it's anywhere near proficient) is that the primary focus will be on the electrical components, to see if they will hold up. Then they will focus on the interaction with the material, flammability points, etc. Keep in mind, I've heard it gossiped they deliberately test things until they break, just to see how much beyond a so-called "normal use" it would have to go.

NO amount of liability warnings beforehand will really deter any individual skada-bent on suing you. Having a manufacturer stamp or private testing agency label will help, but not eliminate, keeping the "quick buck" crowd at bay.

Case in point: on Instructables.com there's an 'ible (their pet name for a series of instructions how to) to make your own bathroom fixture using cast iron pipe. There was a huge debate on using this, as experts weighed in on both sides. Yes, safe to use as long as it's properly grounded. No, not safe at all because the pipe is conductive and will wear through the insulation on the cord, regardless of grounding. Two years later, it's still being argued. true, this is more DIY than for sale, but there's always going to be someone who doesn't think it's safe.