Stainning Cherry

[siman]

Hello everyone,

I'm new here and would just like to thank everyone for all the great information. I have a cabinet project I'm doing. It's made of cherry and I need to match (as close as possible) some other cabinets in the room. Unfortunately, the stain is very dark. The closest color I've seen is GF's merlot dye stain. My problem is of course blotching. So I've tried pretreating some test pieces with a 1lb cut of shellac. Certainly takes care of the blotching problem, but doesn't allow for a dark enough finished product. So I've also tried GF's gel stain (antique cherry), while the results were better, it's still not nearly dark enough. I supose I can (and will try) applying several coats. I know I can do this with the gel stain, but not sure if I can with the dye stain. Has anyone tried using GF's dye stain mixed into the top coat as a toner. Would this be a possible approach? If so, would you try it over bare wood, sealed wood, or sealed wood that has one coat of dye stain already on it? Hmm, so many options. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

[mlehikoinen]

You're right about multiple coats. I did that with some off cuts of walnut with wide variations in shade. Some took 3 coats while some only took one. I just brushed it on thick and wiped it off after 3-4 minutes so as not to obscure the grain. Let it dry and repeat as necessary. Then topcoat with finish of choice. Try it on test pieces first though that were prepped the same way as your project pieces.

That's where my expertise ends.

Maybe there's a dye out there that will help? I'd be interested to hear more from someone more experienced with dye.

[bois]

I realize this advice seems to be getting a bit repetitive, but it's very effective. Try the Charles Neil blotch control product as your sealer coat instead of the shellac. I've used this successfully with darker trans-tint dyes with good success (I think this product allows stains and dyes to penetrate better than a spit coat of shellac). I did a video blog post on my technique for getting hard maple to look like antique mahogany - a similar process should work here just with a different dye. My personal preference is to use a dye over a stain especially with cherry. A dye will retain much more of the characteristic grain pattern, while a stain over a sealer coat will muddle the grain (almost like a glaze).

http://theboisshop.blogspot.com/2010/09/faux-show.html

[siman]

Thanks for alll the advice. I wound up using a 1lb cut of shellac as a prefinish sealer. Then applied 4 coats of the GF water based dye stain. It turned out beautiful. I'm in the process of putting the top coat on over the next couple of days. The shellac definitely stopped any blotching issues, but still allowed plenty of color from the dye stain.

Thanks again,

Craig

[Bob Rozaieski]

Most commercial cabinets you see that are labeled as "cherry" are either not really cherry, or if they are, they are not stained. Instead, they use colored top coats and glazes that sit on top of the wood to add the color without blotching. The down side to this is that these finishes obscure the grain some, but the upside is that they don't blotch because they are film finishes and not penetrating dyes or pigments.

You can get the same effect by coloring the shellac you use with a dye product made for tinting shellac. I think Trans Tint makes some. Basically, any alcohol based dye can be used to color shellac. Adjust the amount of dye and the number of coats of the shellac to get you close to the correct tone you are going for, but maybe a little light. You can then further adjust and darken the color with a glaze. Gel pigment stains work well for glazing. Just wipe them on thick over the colored shellac coats (after the shellac has cured for a week or so), let the gel set up some, then wipe away enough of the excess until the color matches the other cabinets. You can leave some glaze in corners and crevices to give the piece a little more of a broken in or aged appearance if you like. Allow the glaze coat(s) to dry for several days to ensure it is dried completely. Then top coat (e.g. varnish) and rub out.

Lots of steps, but it gives the look of "cherry" that is so often used in commercial cabinets.

[markhochstein]

I, personally, refuse to dye or stain Cherry if I can help it. It just kills the wood for me. Cherry is my favorite wood to work with because of the luminescence it has when finished. Dyes and stains completely kill that effect. Having said that, if the "customer" wants cherry (and is willing to pay for it) and still wants it stained then so be it. But normally when I show them what Poplar looks like with a dark "Antique Cherry" dye and stain treatment -and the accompanying price drop, they almost always leap at that. I find that when most people say they want Cherry, what they really mean is dark reddish-brown - and they really don't care much about the grain as long as it's not Oak.

I hope you find a combination that works. It will inevitably be trial and error, but it will be worth it when you're finished.