Glueing up stock

[msadkin]

Any thoughts on what limitations should be used when glueing 1x's together for a project? I know that its been stated that wide boards have a tendency to cup. When buying boards for a project, is it ok to go with a flat 1x10 or 1x12 or should they be ripped and glued up? I come from the school of "If it ain't broke...", and don't want to make unneeded extra work if I don't have to. On the other hand, I don't want to have my project turn into a pretzel after the first humid day.

Thanks for any input.

Mike

[cormier33]

I remember being taught years ago that ripping the boards and flipping every second one over would ensure no significant cupping over the length of a laminated board. Basically, one would cup up, the next down, the next up and so on.

Now, I would have to add that in doing so, grain doesn't always match up and it may not be as pleasant to look at. This may not be a concern if you are applying a really dark stain.

I would be interested to know what more experienced woodworkers would have to say.

[Sac]

I really think that there is more to this.. Like what is the application? What is the total width? What methods of joinery are being used? What kind of environment will this be in? What kind of wood is being used? Do you have a plan for what you are planning to make? I think this can help someone answer you question a little better.

I could be looking into this a little too much, but these are the things that I take into consideration when thinking about what stock that I am gonna use. There are things that you can do to keep wider boards from cupping, but again it depends on the application.

For example, I recently bought some cherry and was able to score on a nice 4/4 piece that is about 14" wide. I already have an idea for a project for it. And there is no way in heck that I am gonna rip it into pieces and glue it back up. I am gonna use it as is. I know that I am gonna use it for a top to a hall table. I plan on securing it on the ends to keep it from cupping, but also allowing for wood movement. I also plan on securing it along the side s in some aspect, but I still need to figure out how I am going to do that to allow for wood movement.

Now if you were going to use this for something like a book shelf, then you might have some other issues that you would need to work through. SO like I said, it is all situation dependent. Give us an idea of what you want to do. And we might be able to help you out a little more.

[Frank Speyerer]

Does the "cup-up/cup-down" theory apply to kiln dried lumber?

[Beechwood Chip]

Does the "cup-up/cup-down" theory apply to kiln dried lumber?

Yes. No matter how dry a board is or how it was dried, it can still absorb water and expand.

I agree with SAC - you have to take wood movement into account in your design, but there's no one required way to do it.

Gluing up thin pieces is one way to deal with cupping, but I generally think of that as, "If all you have is thin pieces, and the grain doesn't match anyway, then when you do your glue-up you might as well flip to reduce cupping."

Another way to deal with CUP is to use a quartersawn board, where the grain lines on the end of the board are perpendicular to the face. It will expand and contract side-to-side but won't cup much.

Or you can cut a thin veneer and glue to a stable substrate.

Or you can use a frame and panel design (but probably not for a table top, because the gaps will collect debris).

Or you can screw the top to cross pieces using elongated holes so that the wood can expand side-to-side but can't move up and down.

I'm sure that there are other methods as well.

[msadkin]

I really think that there is more to this.. Like what is the application? What is the total width? What methods of joinery are being used? What kind of environment will this be in? What kind of wood is being used? Do you have a plan for what you are planning to make? I think this can help someone answer you question a little better.

I could be looking into this a little too much, but these are the things that I take into consideration when thinking about what stock that I am gonna use. There are things that you can do to keep wider boards from cupping, but again it depends on the application.

For example, I recently bought some cherry and was able to score on a nice 4/4 piece that is about 14" wide. I already have an idea for a project for it. And there is no way in heck that I am gonna rip it into pieces and glue it back up. I am gonna use it as is. I know that I am gonna use it for a top to a hall table. I plan on securing it on the ends to keep it from cupping, but also allowing for wood movement. I also plan on securing it along the side s in some aspect, but I still need to figure out how I am going to do that to allow for wood movement.

Now if you were going to use this for something like a book shelf, then you might have some other issues that you would need to work through. SO like I said, it is all situation dependent. Give us an idea of what you want to do. And we might be able to help you out a little more.

Here is the project I'm working on. It's a domed toy chest that's 30" long, 18" deep and 18" tall (not including the top). I am using pine that I bought from HD. I think it's #2. In any case, it's not clear, but in decent shape. I plan on using biscuit for the joinery. There will be small posts on the inside corners to attach the sides, front and back with dowel plugged screws and glue. The environment? Horrible! I live just west of Syracuse, NY. Actually, the toy box will be indoors in typical home.

Thanks to all for your input.

[Pete Bennett]

I really think that there is more to this.. Like what is the application? What is the total width? What methods of joinery are being used? What kind of environment will this be in? What kind of wood is being used? Do you have a plan for what you are planning to make? I think this can help someone answer you question a little better.

I could be looking into this a little too much, but these are the things that I take into consideration when thinking about what stock that I am gonna use. There are things that you can do to keep wider boards from cupping, but again it depends on the application.

For example, I recently bought some cherry and was able to score on a nice 4/4 piece that is about 14" wide. I already have an idea for a project for it. And there is no way in heck that I am gonna rip it into pieces and glue it back up. I am gonna use it as is. I know that I am gonna use it for a top to a hall table. I plan on securing it on the ends to keep it from cupping, but also allowing for wood movement. I also plan on securing it along the side s in some aspect, but I still need to figure out how I am going to do that to allow for wood movement.

Now if you were going to use this for something like a book shelf, then you might have some other issues that you would need to work through. SO like I said, it is all situation dependent. Give us an idea of what you want to do. And we might be able to help you out a little more.

Hi Sac. If you are going to have an apron beneath the top the best way would be to plough a groove along the inside about 1/2" or so from the top and use as many buttons as you feel fit. They will pull it down nice and tight but still allow for movement.