Finishing curly cherry for mantel clock

[NJSoundman]

Hey all,

 

I'm in the process of making a mantel clock out of some excellent curly cherry. I've never worked with figured/curly material before, and I want to do right by it.

 

I watched the TWW video about popping the grain on curly maple, but I'm wondering if this is an appropriate way to go with curly cherry. Looking at the selection of dyes, I'm not totally convinced that dye is the best coarse of action for cherry (or maybe I'm wrong?).

 

I've read a few things about doing a couple coats of BLO followed by shellac. I know that each board is different, so there's no way to know without testing on scraps - but has anyone gone this route, or can impart any wisdom on me for the best way to pop the curly cherry?

 

I would like it to have a durable finish, but nothing too glossy. Really just looking to accentuate the figure as much as possible.

 

Thanks!

Chris

[Eric.]

In my experience, curly cherry is not nearly as figured as curly maple...unless you have some really special boards.  Most often I see figure in cherry where heartwood is getting near to sapwood, as opposed to the severely undulating end grain you find in curly maple.  And this type of figure is not as apt to pop as the curly maple because there won't be such a disparity in absorption between the different grains in the board.  If you're really curious, try some dye on a test board, but definitely don't jump in head first.  My instinct tells me you'll just get a muddled look...extremely blotchy instead of distinctly popped grain.

 

That said, I agree and disagree with Mike...I think the oil in Arm-R-Seal would do a fine job of highlighting the more subtle figure in figured cherry without leaving you with a blotchy mess.  Where I disagree with him is that shellac will accentuate the figure more than Arm-R-Seal...oil intensifies and adds depth and chatoyance to figure far more than shellac does.  However, I do think amber shellac on cherry produces a very warm and rich look...but doesn't do much for figure.  I'd probably do three test boards...one with the dye to prove to yourself it won't be great, one with BLO (or danish oil) then amber shellac top-coat, and one with Arm-R-Seal.  Dollars to donuts you go with the latter of the three.  Good luck, post pics when done.

[NJSoundman]

Thanks for the tips!

I think I will just skip the dye, as I was expecting. I haven't ordered any (have to drive an hour to get it otherwise), so I won't bother with testing that.

I went out today and picked up some BLO, shellac and wiping poly, I will do some tests and see how that goes. I took a couple pics of the raw boards, I will try to add them to this post so you can take a gander.

Thanks!

Chris

[thhazen]

Hey Chris,

 

Any update on this? I'm working with some curly cherry for the first time myself and would love to hear that the Arm-R-Seal is the way to go. I need the simplest solution to a nice looking finish as I have a few hundred boxes to finish!

 

Thanks for sharing anything you learned while testing!

 

Ty

[4-Square]

<muddled look>

+1

 

Curly cherry blothes very badly. There are some techniques for managing the blotch in currly cherry and several blogs dedicated to just this subject... However, the long and short: don't screw with it. Just ignore the curley and concentrate on the Cherry...

 

It's a clock, so protection is optional. I'm making the assumption that you picked the boards carefully for tone/flow, so no equalizer/toning required... So, If this were my project, I'd let the natural beauty of Cherry speak for itself... Forget BLO -- that went-out decades ago, it's just not everyone has gotten the memo... Get yourself some high-quality drying Tung oil, apply a dozen coats, finish with some wax a few weeks later and let it age naturally. In six months, it'll look outstanding. If you can't wait that long, put the clock outside for a couple of hours on a sunny day... As for brands: I happoen to like Sutherland Welles, but that's just me... Formby's is also good... Stay away from the less-expensive products...

[Eric.]

BLO went out decades ago?  Hmmm...guess I didn't get that memo.  It's not great on maple, I'll grant you, since it turns it yellow.  But on cherry and walnut, BLO gives the wood a deep, rich, warm glow.  I would argue that BLO would be perfect for bringing out the figure in that cherry.  Whether or not it turns out stunning or a blotchy mess depends only on how figured the wood is.  What most people consider figured cherry isn't really that figured.  Truly curly cherry looks amazing drowned in oil. 

 

That said, I do think your suggestion to use tung oil then wax would create a very nice, natural finish, and I can't argue with that.  But to dismiss BLO, for whatever reason, is just foolish.  Sorry.

[4-Square]

If you get the idea that what's labeled these days as BLO isn't BLO (and hasen't been for over a decade), then 'nuff said -- you get it. If you don't get that (or don't understand the statement), then I'll send you the memo...   And for a bonus round, what's normally labeled as Tung oil, is rairly Tung oil and hasn't been that way for over a decade as well... SW, Formby's and a few traditional boutique formulaitons are still [mostly] Tung Oil, but the rest have never been anywhere near a Tung tree...

[Eric.]

I know what they call BLO these days is not the same as what they called BLO in the good 'ol days.  But regardless, the stuff they call BLO these days can still make wood beautiful when used wisely.  Just because it's different than it used to be doesn't mean it's no good.

[wtnhighlander]

Amen Kiki!

[4-Square]

Sorry guys, but there is a huge diference in boiling a traditional linseed oil finish and BLO... Huge -- full stop. If you applied both side-by-side on highly-figured stock, you would clearly see the diference -- even at a distance... The point is, the marketing wanks are leveraging the BLO-legacy to sell a product that doesn't perform anywhere close to it's name sake... So maybe you like the look of today's BLO... That's OK by me... Your projects, use what you want... But do yourself a favor; run a little experiment to see just how good it can be (or used to be): Prep yourself a nice stick of Tiger, get a can of BLO and a jar of raw linseed oil. Boil yourself a traditional oil/paraffin finish and apply to half the stick. Apply the store-bought BLO to the other half… Check it out… Many who do this experiment, never go back to off-the-shelf BLO... It's that big a diference... Remember a decade or so ago and the early WB lacquers? The marketing wanks claimed it, "Looked just as good and environmentally friendly at the same time"... Yea right... Now, in all fairness, today’s store-bought BLO is a lot closer to the traditional recipe then the early entrants (just like today's WB are much improved), but there’s still a big difference on highly-figured stock... One important point: Traditional oil/paraffin finishes were applied right from the double-boiler (about 120F-140F) to aid in deep penetration to brining-up figure and chatoyance… Heat was an integral part of the process -- the oil really gets down in the fibers... The diference is really only applicable to highliy figured stock... One of the problems with internet forums re BLO: When posters say they use a BLO finish, they rarely quantify which BLO (from a can or traditional). If you spend time on woodowrking forums, it's usually the former... the lutier-forums, it's usually the latter... Much of the universal praise for BLO is from those applying the traditional formula, but it carries to BLO-in-a-can by extension.

[Tpt life]

I am not sure how you can argue with those of us who 1) have used both traditional BLO and modern substitutes and 2) will testify that both can leave you with pleasing results. No one is arguing the difference between the two. The fact is that I can still buy locally sourced traditional BLO. I can also buy big box modern variants. They can both be used with satisfying effect. Read the label, test on a non project board, come to your own conclusion. Just don't dismiss modern finishes because they are not traditional. Dismiss them when you don't get a pleasing result.

[Coop]

I made a chop for my bench vise out of some figured cherry and used 3 coats of Arm-R-Seal and am well pleased.

[Eric.]

That's not curly cherry there, Coop.  What you're seeing on the edge grain of the two outer pieces are the medullary rays like you see in QSWO.  That's different from curl.  Curl in cherry is similar to the curl in curly maple but the curls usually aren't as tight or intense.  More often you'll see figured cherry boards when they're sawn so that heartwood and sapwood are very close together as long face grain, and it gives almost a quilted look, though it's not the same.  Those are the "figured" cherry boards that end up looking very blotchy after finish.

 

It's much harder to find curly cherry than maple.  If you find a truly curly cherry board, snatch it up.

[Coop]

So my description as "figured" cherry is correct? It's just that figured and curly are not one in the same? OK, thanks. Fortunately, as I like the looks of this wood, I have several bf of it from a tree that I cut down a couple of years ago. Unfortunately, due to the same "figure", it's hard as hell to get two or more boards glued up to make a pleasing pattern for a table top   Kind of wish it was straight grain. 

[Eric.]

Correct, there are a number of types of figure...curl is one of them.  Medullary rays produce another type of figure.  You'll see the med rays in cherry when it's quarter sawn, just like in white oak, except the rays are much smaller and tighter together.

 

If you're trying to match boards up, start off by grouping all the flat sawn boards and all the rift sawn boards and all the quarter sawn boards.

[Coop]

Good idea. Was actually thinking of using some, along w/ walnut to build the Morris chair. Using the cherry for the slats and other non beefy parts.

Oooops, Now I've hijacked this thread. Sorry

[KenMasco]

I've had good success using Potassium Dichromate to darken/age curly cherry then putting 4-6 coats of Liberon Furniture oil on/in till I get the luster I want.  Makes it pop nice.  I recommend you start with 25% of the called for PD mix.  You can't tell how dark it will get without experementing all the way through the finishing process on scraps or a an unseen side of the material.  I wanted to show you a picture of a curly cherry headboard I did, even though the pictiure doesn't do it justice but can't figure out how.