Bobby Slack Posted December 4, 2010 Report Share Posted December 4, 2010 Here are a few pictures of my loose tenons for the outdoor gates 5'wide. Loose Tenons material is 1/2" (resawed from 5/4) quarter sawn white oak. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulMarcel Posted December 4, 2010 Report Share Posted December 4, 2010 I've been toying with the idea of getting this variable width 3/8" roundover bit from Lee-Valley. I use a 3/8" spiral bit to make mortises so this would be perfect to make the sides of the tenon exactly match the mortise. It would work for tenons thicker than 3/8" as you'd just dial in the width and the top/bottom roundovers would be applied with the same radius as the mortising bit. Not that flipping a board when routing those tenons is all that difficult, but I don't have a real 3/8" roundover yet to do this so I've used either other radii or the 3/8"-ish radii of a multi-profile bit; both awkward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby Slack Posted December 5, 2010 Author Report Share Posted December 5, 2010 Paul-Marcel. I use a 1/2" up-spiral bit from CMT. The process is to drill with the router a big hole, full depth at one end, then creep in and drill a couple more. Repeat the process at the other end. Next I get the router and route the whole length one way, go deeper ... come back ... and so on. I use a 1/2" shank so the router bit has a higher success of staying true. I could not understand the rest of your message. I am just dumb. I ripped the board to length, then cut 45 degrees on four corners and finished rounding the board with a block plane (of course Lie-Nielsen) and the tenon is round enough. Did I get it closer to the ballpark? I've been toying with the idea of getting this variable width 3/8" roundover bit from Lee-Valley. I use a 3/8" spiral bit to make mortises so this would be perfect to make the sides of the tenon exactly match the mortise. It would work for tenons thicker than 3/8" as you'd just dial in the width and the top/bottom roundovers would be applied with the same radius as the mortising bit. Not that flipping a board when routing those tenons is all that difficult, but I don't have a real 3/8" roundover yet to do this so I've used either other radii or the 3/8"-ish radii of a multi-profile bit; both awkward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vic Posted December 5, 2010 Report Share Posted December 5, 2010 In the bit Paul is citing. 3/8 should equal round over should equal a 3/8 bit. Normally, when you're using 1/4 inch bit, the round over to use is half that..3/8. At least, that's my understanding from DIY Woodworks. It's been a long time since I used a floating tenon for something and my memory is very unreliable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulMarcel Posted December 5, 2010 Report Share Posted December 5, 2010 Actually, what I was saying is that I am really stupid when I get over-hungry. Basically disregard that reply; it's beyond jacked up. Note to self: while putting up conduit, don't use the top of the freezer as a storage place cuz later you'll put off eating too long cuz "well, the freezer is covered, I'll eat after I uncover it". Going inside for food Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby Slack Posted December 5, 2010 Author Report Share Posted December 5, 2010 Progress report so far ... moving along and is 9 PM ... time for dinner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kesac Posted December 19, 2010 Report Share Posted December 19, 2010 I like the Beadlock jig for such things. I don't care for Rockler, for various reasons, but I do like that little gadget. You can buy the premade sticks of mortise cheaper than you can spend time setting up and making your own. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby Slack Posted December 19, 2010 Author Report Share Posted December 19, 2010 I looked at the beadlock website and probably if I would not have my setup this would be an approach to give a serious look. When I first started Marc did not have this forum so is all his fault. To come for a solution I consulted with the good folks of Festool and they set me up with a solution for mortise locks which I adapted for this application. My approach was to use the Festool plexiglass template which I also use for mortise locks. and a 1/2" up-spiral router bit. The loose tenons were mad of quarter sawn white oak resawed on my table saw from 5/4 stock and finished of on my metabo benchtop 13" planer. To round the edges of the loose tenons I cut a 45 degree cut with my table saw on all corners and finished the rounding with a block plane. So there was my method. I think that this is the method I will stick for a while since I have the machines and accessories for a while. To glue the gates together I am using West System epoxy and the filler is ... I think 404 or 405 which was the toughest one. I like the Beadlock jig for such things. I don't care for Rockler, for various reasons, but I do like that little gadget. You can buy the premade sticks of mortise cheaper than you can spend time setting up and making your own. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike M Posted December 19, 2010 Report Share Posted December 19, 2010 Hey guys, There is a difference between radius and diameter. If you cut your mortises with a 3/8" diameter bit, the radius of the corners is only 3/16". If you want to make loose tenons to fit, you need to use a 3/16" roundover bit to make the tenons. Think of it this way -- The diameter of the mortising bit is twice the radius of the roundover bit to match the mortise. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronnie Posted December 22, 2010 Report Share Posted December 22, 2010 That is some nice work... That jig makes some nice motises...But any thing with the name festtool on it cost a good chunk of change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby Slack Posted December 22, 2010 Author Report Share Posted December 22, 2010 Thank you Ronnie. Yes the Festool brand is dear ... in more ways than one. My approach was because it is flexible and can use this for many other things. I have one router permanently attached to this jig (OF 2000) and works like a champ. I considered using a 3/8" bit and take two passes so I would have a tighter radius but this works fine since I am joining this with epoxy. That is some nice work... That jig makes some nice motises...But any thing with the name festtool on it cost a good chunk of change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronnie Posted December 22, 2010 Report Share Posted December 22, 2010 I have done my share of mortise and tension work and I will tell you that, That is some clean cuts... It looks real professional. And the 3/8s bit works well too. But my question about the bit......? Why didnt you just buy a round over bit. But since you arent going to be able to see the tenion part, I guess It really doesnt matter. Nice project work......................... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby Slack Posted December 22, 2010 Author Report Share Posted December 22, 2010 Ronnie. Thank you for your compliments. This was my first try. I don't understand your comment about the round over bit. These loose tenons will be hidden, they are my "monster dominos" I would consider running the tenon stock on the router table and cut to size. This was my first try. I also figured out that if I use 5/4 stock and resaw this on my table saw there is less waste. My preference is to use 1/2" router bits with 1/2" shanks because of deflection and that is where the 3/8" router bit with a 1/2" shank could "give" ... may be not. I have done my share of mortise and tension work and I will tell you that, That is some clean cuts... It looks real professional. And the 3/8s bit works well too. But my question about the bit......? Why didnt you just buy a round over bit. But since you arent going to be able to see the tenion part, I guess It really doesnt matter. Nice project work......................... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby Slack Posted February 6, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 6, 2011 Oh boy! Long time since my last update on this. I stained the slats and machined dominos to install them to the rails (lower to middle) and ... Middle to top. So far so good. After the dry fit I will stain inside the dominos holes because the slats will be unglued to allow for movement across the grain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wleingang Posted February 10, 2011 Report Share Posted February 10, 2011 This looks awesome. I can't wait to see the finished product. Those tenons look huge to me, but I guess at 5' wide they need to be pretty structural. For my 4' wide gate I just used standard large dominos and the epoxy like you... the thing looks as good as last year when I first glued it up. http://iamwill.com/gate/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby Slack Posted February 13, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 13, 2011 Ready to glue up the stiles. This gate so far is perfectly square. I can't believe I did it. Material is cypress. All dominos in the vertical slats are unglued. I will glue the stiles to the rails with loose tenons (made of quarter sawn white oak) and use West Systems. On the dominos (vertical slats) I sealed the mortises and also the mahogany (for outdoor use) dominos with Sikkens (some of you know I use this all the time). My neighbor chose a different stain to match their home. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby Slack Posted February 13, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 13, 2011 Will. That is a fantastic gate you made. This looks awesome. I can't wait to see the finished product. Those tenons look huge to me, but I guess at 5' wide they need to be pretty structural. For my 4' wide gate I just used standard large dominos and the epoxy like you... the thing looks as good as last year when I first glued it up. http://iamwill.com/gate/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby Slack Posted February 13, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 13, 2011 Next step ... first time West Systems ... wish me luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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