saw sharpening

[nateswoodworks]

I am thinking of getting a Wenzloff and Son dovetail saw kit after the holidays and was wondering if anyone else has went this route, I have watched Bob's saw sharpening video over at Logan Cabinet Shop and it does look pretty straight forward but I have never done it. Just wondering about other's thoughts on this. Thanks and Happy Holidays

Nate

[Roger T]

Nate,

Small teeth are tough to start out on. I think you would be better served to pick up a few old clunker saws, and start there. It easy yes, but not quite as easy as it looks tho. I do ok on big teeth, but small teeth there is a lot less metal to work, and consequently, real easy to get big and small teeth. Start with a 5 or 6 point saw, and go from there. Rip saws are a piece of cake, but crosscut saws, are a whole nother animal. After you have done a few, and made the mistakes, and had to joint out what you just did so you can start over, you will understand.

Go here for a really good bit of information. http://www.vintagesaws.com/library/primer/sharp.html

Hope this helps you out.

Roger

[nateswoodworks]

Thanks Roger, that is what I was afraid of! Bob makes it look easy as I am sure it is for him having the practice. I think I will still get the saw kit already sharpened, just thought it would add a little pride to the saw. At $55 for the saw kit I really don't want to mess it up, I really don't use a handsaw for anything other than small cuts and dovetails so maybe it is a skill I will just not even try. Thanks for everything.

Nate

[Roger T]

Nate, dont be afraid to try it. After you have built some muscle memory, things will get easier. Just start with big teeth and work your way into smaller teeth. It would just be another skill you can add to your resume.

Roger

[nateswoodworks]

Maybe I will practice on the rip saw I have for my son when it needs it, I just don't want to mess up a new saw. It seems like there is never enough time in the shop now!!

Nate

[Vic]

Maybe I will practice on the rip saw I have for my son when it needs it, I just don't want to mess up a new saw. It seems like there is never enough time in the shop now!!

Nate

Nick, PM Shannon. He can give you good advice on that.

[Jonathryn]

Yeah, get a big ol' rip saw with 4 - 6 TPI and give it a go. You'll be surprised at how easy it is. But make sure the file is big enough for the tooth profile and clean the saw with some mineral spirits and sandpaper before you sharpen it. You'd be surprised at how fast a freshly-sharpened saw like that will rip through a 2 x 4.

[Bobby Slack]

For sure you should do this.

And ...

I just got my Lie Nielsen dovetail saw and cutting is not as difficult as it seems. If you are thinking of doing it, go with the saw you want because otherwise you will end up spending the money twice.

The quality of the blade gives you stiffness and holds the edge of the sharpening. So if you want to practice your sharpening skills go ahead and buy an affordable saw.

Hey ... I don't mean to sound like the grudge. No way! That is not my intention.

Good luck with your decision.

Nick, PM Shannon. He can give you good advice on that.

[Bob Rozaieski]

I am thinking of getting a Wenzloff and Son dovetail saw kit after the holidays and was wondering if anyone else has went this route, I have watched Bob's saw sharpening video over at Logan Cabinet Shop and it does look pretty straight forward but I have never done it. Just wondering about other's thoughts on this. Thanks and Happy Holidays

Nate

Mike's kits are great. You won't be disappointed.

In my opinion, it would be easier to learn to sharpen on Mike's saw (or a cheap new saw from the BORG) than an old clunker. The problem with the old clunkers is that more times than not, the teeth are trashed. Completely reshaping badly damaged and badly formed teeth is a different experience from just sharpening a saw that already has good teeth. The reshaping and recutting of teeth is the hard part. Sharpening well formed teeth is easy. That's one of the reasons it looks so easy in my video. The teeth on that saw were already in good shape, so it was easy because all I was doing was sharpening, not reshaping. If you go to a yard sale and buy an old junk saw, the teeth likely won't be as nice as they were on the saw I used in the video. This is where first time saw filers get into trouble and end up with big & little teeth, uneven set, inconsistent rake and fleam angles, etc. In essence, by trying to save your new saw by tackling an old saw first, you are biting off too much.

It seems counterintuitive to practice your filing on a shiny new saw. The common thought is that you don't want to ruin a perfectly good saw. So instead you think that practicing on an old beat up saw is better; and it would be if the old saw had proper teeth to begin with, but that is very rarely the case. Mike's saw, or any cheap new saw, will have perfectly formed teeth because they were cut in by a machine. With the new saws, all you have to do is sharpen, no reshaping necessary. Basically, you joint once or twice to get a very small flat atop each tooth, then file one or two strokes on each tooth until the flat is gone. If you are unsure about how far to go on each tooth, file 2 light strokes on each tooth, then go back and file 1 or 2 more on the ones that still have a small flat on top.

The simple fact is, you can't ruin the saw. Even if you botch the teeth trying to sharpen it yourself, you can send it back to Mike and have him repunch the teeth for a small fee. But I'm betting that you won't botch the teeth. Because they are already properly shaped, you won't be taking off enough steel to botch them. All you'll be doing is taking a couple strokes on each tooth just to put a final sharpening on it. The same cannot be said for an old beater saw that needs a lot of work. I really think it's harder to recondition on old saw than it is to sharpen a new one.

[Bobby Slack]

I did not watch your video Bob and it looks like sharpening a hand saw is very close to re-sharpening a chain saw (which I learned to do by hand).

Mike's kits are great. You won't be disappointed.

In my opinion, it would be easier to learn to sharpen on Mike's saw (or a cheap new saw from the BORG) than an old clunker. The problem with the old clunkers is that more times than not, the teeth are trashed. Completely reshaping badly damaged and badly formed teeth is a different experience from just sharpening a saw that already has good teeth. The reshaping and recutting of teeth is the hard part. Sharpening well formed teeth is easy. That's one of the reasons it looks so easy in my video. The teeth on that saw were already in good shape, so it was easy because all I was doing was sharpening, not reshaping. If you go to a yard sale and buy an old junk saw, the teeth likely won't be as nice as they were on the saw I used in the video. This is where first time saw filers get into trouble and end up with big & little teeth, uneven set, inconsistent rake and fleam angles, etc. In essence, by trying to save your new saw by tackling an old saw first, you are biting off too much.

It seems counterintuitive to practice your filing on a shiny new saw. The common thought is that you don't want to ruin a perfectly good saw. So instead you think that practicing on an old beat up saw is better; and it would be if the old saw had proper teeth to begin with, but that is very rarely the case. Mike's saw, or any cheap new saw, will have perfectly formed teeth because they were cut in by a machine. With the new saws, all you have to do is sharpen, no reshaping necessary. Basically, you joint once or twice to get a very small flat atop each tooth, then file one or two strokes on each tooth until the flat is gone. If you are unsure about how far to go on each tooth, file 2 light strokes on each tooth, then go back and file 1 or 2 more on the ones that still have a small flat on top.

The simple fact is, you can't ruin the saw. Even if you botch the teeth trying to sharpen it yourself, you can send it back to Mike and have him repunch the teeth for a small fee. But I'm betting that you won't botch the teeth. Because they are already properly shaped, you won't be taking off enough steel to botch them. All you'll be doing is taking a couple strokes on each tooth just to put a final sharpening on it. The same cannot be said for an old beater saw that needs a lot of work. I really think it's harder to recondition on old saw than it is to sharpen a new one.