JohnDi Posted December 1, 2013 Report Share Posted December 1, 2013 Just starting milling 4/4 cherry on 6 in jointer. Somehow I'm making wedges? Never happened before. No settings changed since last time I used it. Sighted down the beds and they look to be level to the cutter head. I have a ridgid if that helps. Stock is thinner on one of the long sides. Pieces are 5 inches wide. What the heck am I doing wrong? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 1, 2013 Report Share Posted December 1, 2013 maybe you are using the wrong tool. if one face is flat then run it through the planer to make the other face parallel to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
..Kev Posted December 1, 2013 Report Share Posted December 1, 2013 Did you check the blades and make sure their seated properly? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric. Posted December 1, 2013 Report Share Posted December 1, 2013 Your tables are not coplanar or there's something wrong with your technique. I'd get a good straight edge and check the tables first...you can't tell if they're out of alignment by sighting down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnDi Posted December 1, 2013 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2013 Only straightedge I have that long is a level. Will go down and try it. Don't think baldes are the culprit, still the original blades, never touched. Is it possible to put too much pressure on one side? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trip Posted December 1, 2013 Report Share Posted December 1, 2013 ==> Your tables are not coplanar bingo... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom King Posted December 1, 2013 Report Share Posted December 1, 2013 Hold it down on the outfeed table, not the infeed table. Once you make sure the machine is set up correctly, the most important part is that the piece rides in full contact with the outfeed table on the last pass. If you can get someone who knows how to make straight boards with all sorts that don't start straight, it will save you some time, and wasted wood. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trip Posted December 1, 2013 Report Share Posted December 1, 2013 ==> Will go down and try it. Think Marc has a podcast on jointer setup procedure... Jointers are Jumping comes to mind... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodger. Posted December 2, 2013 Report Share Posted December 2, 2013 There was another post like this recently. A jointer has no way of knowing what the opposite face or edge being jointed is like. You may be making wedges just because the stock is really "unflat". It is not uncommon for some slight "wedging" action on a wonky board. This, of course, means there is a lot of waste on that board. Do a test on an existing staight piece if possible. If the known straight piece goes wedge shaped, then you def have a machine set up issue or technique error. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jfitz Posted December 2, 2013 Report Share Posted December 2, 2013 Check the tables to see if they are coplanar. Even if you do not have a good straightedge, you can accomplish this with lengths of fine string (or wire) - stretch them over the table and over either ends, and put a very small thickness item (maybe a shaving or some feeler gauges) under the string at either end. The gap along the string should be a consistent amount along the outfeed table and a consistent amount along the indeed table. Check it at the front and again at the rear. It could also be the knives. I had that same issue with that same jointer, and it was because my knives were off. Imagine that the back of the blade is up a little higher than the front. Now imagine setting the depth of cut so that that near side of the knife cuts very little but the far side of the knife (towards the fence), being higher, makes a deeper cut. The more you pass the board over it, the more of the far edge of the board will be removed - thus making more and more of a wedge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick2cd Posted December 2, 2013 Report Share Posted December 2, 2013 I had the same problem with the same jointer. I had the outfeed table set dead level with the knives. Lowered the outfeed table a few thousandths and it solved everything. Sounds crazy, but it works. It's a good jointer once u dial it in.....longer beds would be nice though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trip Posted December 2, 2013 Report Share Posted December 2, 2013 ==> Sounds crazy, but it works There are a lot of old-times (read as Father, Grandfather) that set the arc of the cutterhead 1.5thou above the outfeed table... There's several write-ups supporting it. I'm keeping the tradition going... I've found that 1.0thou gets me flat every time.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwacker Posted December 2, 2013 Report Share Posted December 2, 2013 Just starting milling 4/4 cherry on 6 in jointer. Somehow I'm making wedges? Never happened before. No settings changed since last time I used it. Sighted down the beds and they look to be level to the cutter head. I have a ridgid if that helps. Stock is thinner on one of the long sides. Pieces are 5 inches wide. What the heck am I doing wrong?image.jpg If you're making wedges across the face out of the blue as in the photo the first thing you would check would be the knives. But I doubt that you have any problem at all. Since this just popped up out of no where its more likely a twisted board. This is where technique and table length come into play. When you joint a board you don't just flop it down an run it across the joiner. You lay it on the table and examine the surface for twist and warps. With a twist you float the ends meaning you joint the center of the board removing the twist so as not to create a wedge. You have to put some thought into it. Sometimes you will see it just won't work without the board becoming to thin so that board will have to be cut in half and used on a piece that is much shorter. The key to successful jointing is planning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaBear Posted December 2, 2013 Report Share Posted December 2, 2013 Ok, not to be contrary, but who cares? So long as the face is FLAT, and no twist, then the jointer has done it's job. Any other attributes, are another tool's job, the planer typicaly... If your knives were wrong/mis-aligned, you'd get other issues like either a concave or convex board.. If that's happening, yes, definitely start adjusting things on the jointer. If all you are worried about is that off the jointer, the board is wedge shaped, well, that simply may be a factor of that being the shape the jointer needed to use to get one face flat.. Hope that makes sense... My 2cents, your mileage may vary.. Ciao.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwacker Posted December 2, 2013 Report Share Posted December 2, 2013 Ok, not to be contrary, but who cares? So long as the face is FLAT, and no twist, then the jointer has done it's job. Any other attributes, are another tool's job, the planer typicaly... If your knives were wrong/mis-aligned, you'd get other issues like either a concave or convex board.. If that's happening, yes, definitely start adjusting things on the jointer. If all you are worried about is that off the jointer, the board is wedge shaped, well, that simply may be a factor of that being the shape the jointer needed to use to get one face flat.. Hope that makes sense... My 2cents, your mileage may vary.. Ciao.. Why not learn to use the machine properly? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnDi Posted December 2, 2013 Author Report Share Posted December 2, 2013 Thanks for all the replies. I think PB had it. I stopped jointing after seeing the wedged board, but today I started on the rest of the parts and most are fine. I think one or two may have been twisted and I didn't know enough to check for that. Thanks to all of your help I am now paying attention to many more things when using the jointer that will make my projects much better going forward. Thanks again for all of help offered here. HAPPY HOLIDAYS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ottacat Posted December 2, 2013 Report Share Posted December 2, 2013 Twist is really hard to deal with on a jointer. I was reading Marc's book last night and he made the same observation and pointed out this was a good use for a handplane to know down the two opposing high points. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom King Posted December 3, 2013 Report Share Posted December 3, 2013 It's not THAT hard, but probably does require some experience doing it. You have to help for some number of passes with your hands as they hold the board until you have enough of a flat surface somewhere to ride on the table. I expect it takes some practice to have a feel to know how to hold the board. Sometimes the fence doesn't do you a whole lot of good on the first surface. I know it took me a long time to teach my helpers to be able to sight down a board, and SEE what they needed to do. I think PB's comment that it requires "planning" is a great one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trip Posted December 3, 2013 Report Share Posted December 3, 2013 ==> Twist is really hard to deal with on a jointer. An 'old-timer trick' my dad taught me: Drop a little sawdust on the in-feed table at the two opposing corners, then just pass the board over the cutter-head -- the sawdust stays with the board and supports the cut... Works... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwacker Posted December 3, 2013 Report Share Posted December 3, 2013 Finesse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric. Posted December 3, 2013 Report Share Posted December 3, 2013 I don't find it that difficult to remove twist. As long as the pressure is exerted on the two low points and the board isn't rocking and being flattened in different areas on each consecutive pass, it will get flat...eventually. The trouble I have with twist is salvaging enough thickness. This is why I spend extra time at the lumberyard picking primo sticks. Screw bowed and twisted boards...there's plenty of wood out there to choose from. It's gotta be one amazing piece of lumber if I'm gonna deal with that. A twisted board is also screaming at you that she's gonna be a high maintenance PITA throughout the entire project. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom King Posted December 3, 2013 Report Share Posted December 3, 2013 Good point Eric. We hand pick every board, including framing when we're building a new house. I put a guy at each end of the stack. I sight the board and hand it straight over if it goes on the trailer, and down if it goes in the reject pile. No talking necessary. Once we have what we want. We restack the reject pile back on the rack neatly. Some of the suppliers don't let people do this, but the ones who know us do. They know we're going to leave the stack in good shape when we leave. People who call for an order of lumber get what the guys on the yard pull off the stack first. I do keep a stash of clear pine, treated and untreated, drying for a year or more before we use it to get door jambs, steps, and such out of. Any time we're at a building supply to get something else, and we see a likely, new bundle of lumber, we'll pick through it, and carry any good boards we find home for later use. I used to be able to buy good quality 5/4 clear pine boards for door jambs, but that was some years ago. Now all our 4/4 YP finish boards come out of the 2x boards that have had a year to do what moving they're going to do. Often, these will need some finessing on the jointer to get a flat and straight starting side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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