thewoodwhisperer Posted January 6, 2012 Report Share Posted January 6, 2012 As I approach the base portion of the workbench build, I find myself wondering if I should bother with the knock-down joinery. For me personally, being able to remove the top is mobility enough for if/when I move the bench to a different location. Flat-packing it just isn't necessary. So I'm thinking I will just use glue and drawbore the joints. My question for those who are building this bench is, do you see a real need for the knock-down joinery? I might just cover the drilling technique using sample pieces so you can see how it is done. But I am trying to gauge just how many folks actually plan on using this method. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grim Posted January 6, 2012 Report Share Posted January 6, 2012 I'm doing knockdown. I'm living in a duplex house right now paying rent. We hope to move in a few years and hopefully have a lil bit more space. Thus, the knockdown just make sense because it will take up a WHOLE lot more room in the UHaul otherwise. I got the barrel nuts from benchrafted.. nice stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndremG Posted January 6, 2012 Report Share Posted January 6, 2012 I'm going knockdown as well. My shop is a small section of my basement and I'm shoehorning the bench in place as it is. We have plans to build a two-car garage which will be mine when it doesn't have cars parked in it. So I know I'll have to move that puppy at least once in my lifetime. While I don't need to flat pack it, the knockdown will allow me to minimize it to manageable pieces that are compatible with my basement stairs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MansFineFurn Posted January 7, 2012 Report Share Posted January 7, 2012 Not doing the build with the guild, as I built mine a couple years ago, but my two cents: If you can do it like marc (not full knockdown) do it - nothing to tighten over time. It won't take much more room in a uhaul (you can pile stuff all over the base and top in there, no worries. If you can't move the base assembly without knockdown, then, well, you know what you've gotta do. I think a demo of the procedure on scrap would be sufficient for those needing the visual guidance. Marc: since you've got a substantial group building along, maybe there is a video capable member you can work with to get footage and voice over as needed. Just a thought. I would say try Vic, but I think you talked him out of knockdown! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vic Posted January 7, 2012 Report Share Posted January 7, 2012 Yes, you did! I'm also thinking of not actually dadoing the shelf boards into the base , but rather glue on ledger strips and let the boards float on top. The wood I'm using will never warp, so why go to the trouble of letting them in. (null) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewoodwhisperer Posted January 7, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 7, 2012 Yeah that does seem like a logical move. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barron Posted January 7, 2012 Report Share Posted January 7, 2012 I am going with the knock down. In fact I may be racing the moving van trying to get this done. Just don't know what direction the van will be headed - my wife is in for jobs on the east coast and the west coast. In any case we tend to move often and it will make life easier. A demo video is probably fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texfire Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 I'm leaning towards the knockdown version, but from a perspective of not having much experience with M&T and no experience with drawboring. I'd kinda like to see the more complicated method, and a walk through of marking for the knockdown bolts, maybe a practice joint demonstrating it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric. Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 I would prefer non-knockdown. I plan to die in this house in 100 years or so, and I plan to never build another bench. So I'd like to see as much detail as possible, but I understand if you can't go into all of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewoodwhisperer Posted January 8, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 Keep in mind, that regardless of the knockdown concept, the bench still requires large drawbored m/t joints. If you were to make a "non-knockdown" version, you simply omit the step where the bolts are added to the 4 long stretcher joints and use glue instead (and drawbore if desired). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaiser Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 As I approach the base portion of the workbench build, I find myself wondering if I should bother with the knock-down joinery. For me personally, being able to remove the top is mobility enough for if/when I move the bench to a different location. Flat-packing it just isn't necessary. So I'm thinking I will just use glue and drawbore the joints. My question for those who are building this bench is, do you see a real need for the knock-down joinery? I might just cover the drilling technique using sample pieces so you can see how it is done. But I am trying to gauge just how many folks actually plan on using this method. I am up in the air...I am building this bench for my lifetime and hopefully my sons lifetime and for that matter his sons. I do not ever plan on being up and down stairs with this thing, but who knows if my son decides he wants to get a lof in downtown Manhatten in a 5 story walk up. Then knockdown would be nice for him, but being that it is my bench, for the interim, I am probably going to do a through tenon and rising dovetail on the legs if I am feeling up to the task. I do like the traditional and asthetic look to this system and it is also very solid with or without glue. Well I hope this post puts more people on the fence like myself so I don't have to be alone. ciao, THE KAISER Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
konkers Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 I am probably going to do a through tenon and rising dovetail on the legs if I am feeling up to the task. I do like the traditional and asthetic look to this system and it is also very solid with or without glue. Well I hope this post puts more people on the fence like myself so I don't have to be alone. Are you talking about doing a rising dovetail for attaching the legs to the top? I've been considering that as well but it does present an assembly challenge since the rising dovetails slide in at an angle. Have you puzzled this one out? If so, do share. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaiser Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 Are you talking about doing a rising dovetail for attaching the legs to the top? I've been considering that as well but it does present an assembly challenge since the rising dovetails slide in at an angle. Have you puzzled this one out? If so, do share. yes. This is not a sliding dovetail. the tenon on this inside of the leg is what makes it a challenge. So what I am planning on doing is make the legs in 2 sections and glue them up after they are in the top. In other words, I will put in the sliding rising dovetail section of the leg, then slide the monster tenon on the backside section of the leg into the top and glue them together in place. I will try to post pics. Another way you can do it is to not put on your outermost laminate on your top and cut it to the rising dovetail after the legs are in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaiser Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 the tricky part is getting the stretchers together with this way of doing this. Once I work that out I will post it. Are you talking about doing a rising dovetail for attaching the legs to the top? I've been considering that as well but it does present an assembly challenge since the rising dovetails slide in at an angle. Have you puzzled this one out? If so, do share. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
konkers Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 the tricky part is getting the stretchers together with this way of doing this. Once I work that out I will post it. Yeah.. that's where I'm hung up... I was thinking of maybe doing rising dovetails only on the front legs and angled tenons on the back legs. that way the whole top can go on at once at the same angle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vic Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 I'll try to remember to link to a friend's post on the rising DT later. Erik, do you remember meeting Ryan from WIA? He was from Salt Lake City. Great guy! (null) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffB1 Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 Marc,I'm sticking with the plan in the knockdowns what I understand now is that the drawbore pins and joint do not necessarily need to be glued. So you could do a non-metal knockdown so to speak. Is that what you're thinking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewoodwhisperer Posted January 9, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 9, 2012 Well once a tenon is drawbored, it isn't going to want to come undone. I suppose you could drill out the pins to disassemble if you wanted to. But I plan on gluing everything together. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaiser Posted January 9, 2012 Report Share Posted January 9, 2012 Yeah.. that's where I'm hung up... I was thinking of maybe doing rising dovetails only on the front legs and angled tenons on the back legs. that way the whole top can go on at once at the same angle. Yes. Good idea. I still see a problem as far as gettiing the stretchers in after the legs are installed. I just might use a whale tail on the face of the stretchers into the face of the legs to remedy this issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
konkers Posted January 9, 2012 Report Share Posted January 9, 2012 Yes. Good idea. I still see a problem as far as gettiing the stretchers in after the legs are installed. I just might use a whale tail on the face of the stretchers into the face of the legs to remedy this issue. If you do the rear legs like that, you can assemble the base completely then attach the top. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephens_Shop Posted January 9, 2012 Report Share Posted January 9, 2012 I am leaning towards a full glue-up as I do not anticipate moving again (I sure hope I am right on that one). The bench is going to be heavy but I should think that if a move is in order I could move it along with the rest of the equipment in my shop and use it to hold boxes of all my other tools etc. I just don't want to have to go around and tighten up the joints as they work loose. This may be more of a concern in my situation as I intend to build with Douglas Fir which is softer than Maple or the SYP options. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwightbartlett Posted January 13, 2012 Report Share Posted January 13, 2012 I'm going the glued draw-bore route. Not planning on a move but if it happens the bench (hard maple) will still be significantly easier (lighter) to move than stationary power tools! Marc, you could always build yourself a nice side table with 4 inch legs and stretchers to demo the use of the Benchcrafted knock down hardware. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaiser Posted January 14, 2012 Report Share Posted January 14, 2012 Yeah.. that's where I'm hung up... I was thinking of maybe doing rising dovetails only on the front legs and angled tenons on the back legs. that way the whole top can go on at once at the same angle. They would have to angle in the same direction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaiser Posted January 14, 2012 Report Share Posted January 14, 2012 If you do the rear legs like that, you can assemble the base completely then attach the top. this would be really cool to see and I have decided to go the standard route with my legs. Maybe on my sons bench I will come up with a crazy detail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewoodwhisperer Posted January 14, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2012 you could always build yourself a nice side table with 4 inch legs and stretchers to demo the use of the Benchcrafted knock down hardware. Mmmmm...that sounds beautiful! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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