RJsumthn Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 I am building a new workbench and I am thinking about how I will attach the top which will be made of kiln dried 2x4's laminated together. The legs will be made from some 12/4 Poplar. The attached pictures are of the design I did in SketchUp (it was my first time using SketchUp to don't be critical about the drawing). Ideally I would like the bench top to be easily replaced since it will only be made of softwoods and can't afford to use hardwood on it right now. I was thinking a couple big wood screws would work but I don't know if that would hold up to the lateral forces of hand planing. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. I was also curious the left side of the table with the 18" overhang of the top for a front vise and whether or not that will be strong enough to hold the front vise or will if cause it to sag over time. Thanks. Oh and if you see any major flaws in the design please let me know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dlhunter Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 If you wind up using screws to attach the top I would recommend these; http://www.fastenmaster.com/details/product/trusslok-inch-engineered-wood-fastener.html You can get them at the big box stores. They're kind of pricey but you can usually buy them individually Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duckkisser Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 i did something similar you might want to plan on mounting some kind of storage underneath im going to build some drawers under mine to store some of my tools in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJsumthn Posted February 2, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 I saw your post duckkisser. I don't see myself putting drawers on the bench unless I were to set them back at least 4 inches. I see myself clamping pieces onto the bench and also if I decide to put holes in the top, I don't want the drawers getting in the way of the holdfast. I might however make a shelf with the bottom stretchers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beechwood Chip Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 Would you consider mortise and tenon joints to hold the top in place? They would definitely keep the top from moving across the legs, and the weight of the top will keep it from falling off. When you make a new top, just cut some matching mortices. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dodgeram99 Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 I would drill the holes in the legs just a little bigger then the screw. This will allow for wood movement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJsumthn Posted February 2, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 A loose tenon would be good and easy to incorporate into the design. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pghmyn Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 If you weren't up to mortise and tenons, possibly even some dowels in each leg would work. Then, to top it off, some screws. Just throwing another option out there 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJsumthn Posted February 2, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 Dowels would be easier than a loose tenon. I would think the dowels would have to be at least 3/4" 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duckkisser Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 I saw your post duckkisser. I don't see myself putting drawers on the bench unless I were to set them back at least 4 inches. I see myself clamping pieces onto the bench and also if I decide to put holes in the top, I don't want the drawers getting in the way of the holdfast. I might however make a shelf with the bottom stretchers. im planning on dropping my drawer box down several inches so there is a gap. then i can clamp, have hold fasts, and it will catch chips and dust that fall through my dog holes from carving. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G S Haydon Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 Nice Bench. Simple and strong. I am sure it would work out well. Perhaps you could combine some nice heavy coach screws and washers like these http://www.mrstainless.com.au/stainless-steel-coach-screws along with the dowels for a belt and braces approach. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJsumthn Posted February 2, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 duckkisser - That is a good idea. Maybe It wouldn't be a bad idea to put a big drawer where the gap is to catch the chips and dust so you can pull it out to clean it instead of having to reach up there with a vac or brush to get the dust. And also make the drawer easy to take out for when you do need to clamp something to the bench. Or instead of a drawer make it just a big sturdy tray so it can catch the dust, be easily removed, and if you take it out and turn upside down on the top of the bench it can be a riser block for doing intricate work so you are not bent over so far. G S Haydon - Coach screws also be a good idea. With loose tenons or dowels, could wood expansion be an issue? I know you can make screw hole bigger to account for wood expansion but it would seem to me that might allow the top to shift slightly. Maybe if I just put a dowel or loose tenon on the back side of the table and then put screws on the front side (with bigger holes in the legs to allow for wood movement)? I think that might be the best bet, it will secure the top and prevent lateral movement but still allow for the wood to movement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duckkisser Posted February 2, 2013 Report Share Posted February 2, 2013 not a bad idea dont think ill do the drawer but i might make a drawer hard top that i can set on top of bench when i have to hammer away on something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G S Haydon Posted February 3, 2013 Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 RJsumthn You plan sounds good and would allow for seasonal movement. Look forward to seeing the finished article. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodger. Posted February 3, 2013 Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 You could attach the top from the underside with L brackets or shop made "buttons". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric. Posted February 4, 2013 Report Share Posted February 4, 2013 To address one element of your design: I don't think you'll have problems with sag on the 18" overhang, but you'll probably have stability issues...not wood stability, but bench stability. Marc released a Guild video in the Roubo series about why his original bench sucked, and one of his biggest complaints, aside from limited workholding abilities, was that the whole bench moved around too much when he was using the vise for particular tasks...and his was built with hard maple. He could lift the opposite end of the bench off the ground by applying just part of his body weight to the vise end. If you're dead-set on that design, I'd at least make the whole thing substantially thicker, or save up to buy hardwood...the 2x4s from the box stores are extremely light, and you won't have enough mass to keep the bench planted when you're working agressively on something. It'll work for 95% of your tasks, but it's going to be frustrating at times when it won't stay put. At least consider using a hardwood for the base, and upgrading the top in the future. You should be able to find maple or ash for decent prices if you do some research...or even red oak...or any hardwood besides poplar. The stuff is just too light for a bench, IMO. I'd also recommend allowing the SPF lumber to sit in your shop, stacked and stickered, for a month or two before you start working with it. Their idea of kiln dried is basically "not sopping wet," and if you build your bench with that stuff as soon as you bring it home, I can almost guarantee you'll regret it, if a flat top is something you desire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJsumthn Posted February 4, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 4, 2013 Thanks Eric for all the advice. Yes, I know the weight will be an issue. I face that issue with my current bench and I put a 100lbs sand bag on the bottom and that took care of it. I might do the same for the new bench. This will not be the last bench that I build. This is my first project using mortise and tenon joinery and actually milling lumber completely flat and square. So this bench is more to gain experience. I could have just milled and cut mortise and tenons on scraps but this way I will have something to show for it. Unfortunately I've already started to mill and glue the 2x4's. But I didn't have the expectations of a dead flat top since the bench will be in a garage without climate control so even if I got it dead flat to start it wouldn't stay that way for long. I hope to get a couple good years out of this bench but either way I am gaining invaluable experience and knowledge. After all it is Get Woodworking week!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodger. Posted February 5, 2013 Report Share Posted February 5, 2013 Thanks Eric for all the advice. Yes, I know the weight will be an issue. I face that issue with my current bench and I put a 100lbs sand bag on the bottom and that took care of it. I might do the same for the new bench. This will not be the last bench that I build. This is my first project using mortise and tenon joinery and actually milling lumber completely flat and square. So this bench is more to gain experience. I could have just milled and cut mortise and tenons on scraps but this way I will have something to show for it. Unfortunately I've already started to mill and glue the 2x4's. But I didn't have the expectations of a dead flat top since the bench will be in a garage without climate control so even if I got it dead flat to start it wouldn't stay that way for long. I hope to get a couple good years out of this bench but either way I am gaining invaluable experience and knowledge. After all it is Get Woodworking week!! You could also fasten it to the floor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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