Broken Sander

[Chestnut]

So I've had my ETS EC 150/3  for nearly 5 years. In those 5 years it has served me well. With my hand plane usage I don't use my sander as often as most and have only gone through about 100 sheets of paper. I have only ever bought a 100 pack of 120 grit and a 100 pack of 180 grit and both are about half full yet. Just yesterday I noticed something funky with my cord. I looked at the end and noticed that there was a pin missing from inside the sander that got lodged in the end of the detachable cord. My first thought was the inconvience of having to ship the sander for repair and the time lost with out it with Christmas coming up fast.

I looked close at the sander and noticed the plug socket was a different color from the case. I found all the screws on the case and thought "Well if it's going in for service it won't hurt to take a peak inside". After gently opening the side of the sander i noticed the plug would slide out easily and had 2 spade terminals to remove it. I called into festool asked about the part, found out it was all of $9 and would likely be at my house in 2 days.

I have to say this is awesome. The repair is really easy, the customer service was friendly nice and helpful and despite it breaking I can't help but appreciate how smooth and easy this is. I get that this sander is expensive but I can't help but appreciate how well designed and made it is.

Here is another picture of the inside because it looks interesting.

[JohnG]

Glad you were able to get the part! The sander itself seems to be hard to come by these days. My local shop has had one on order for me for a few months now…

[Coop]

Well done! Their twist and lock cord design has kind of worried me, not to the loss of sleep but just a little. What would happen if they ever discontinued this and went a different direction? I’m almost tempted to buy an extra cord and now that you have found that the female is available, buy one of those as well. Not sure how justified that would be? 

[Coop]

And speaking of Festool sanders, my pad just came disconnected from the base. Is that a common problem. 

[BonPacific]

On 12/10/2021 at 5:48 PM, Coop said:

Well done! Their twist and lock cord design has kind of worried me, not to the loss of sleep but just a little. What would happen if they ever discontinued this and went a different direction? I’m almost tempted to buy an extra cord and now that you have found that the female is available, buy one of those as well. Not sure how justified that would be? 

It sounds like the internal connection is pretty straight forward, so worst case you have to pop it open and wire a new non-festool cord or plug, similar to a stationary tool. Not ideal since the strain relief is integral, but should be doable.

[Chestnut]

10 hours ago, Coop said:

What would happen if they ever discontinued this and went a different direction?

I don't think that festool will do that. They have been committed to this plug style for a long time and it's working for them.

Festool also has a commitment to a minimum of 10 years of parts for all of their tools, I didn't check the most recent versions of the sander but this plug is used in most of the ETS EC sanders so it's likely to continue for at least 10 more years more likely a LOT more. This sander and that part are popular.

It is probably worth mentioning that different tools use a different cord plug. The domino is different as is the router etc.

10 hours ago, Coop said:

And speaking of Festool sanders, my pad just came disconnected from the base. Is that a common problem. 

I'm not sure? Depends on if the bolt came out of the pad ripped off. It's supposed to be a wear item and get replaced so you might just need a new one.

[Coop]

The pad itself separated.

[Chestnut]

Wow lay off the spinach?

[Coop]

I have my CT 26 set at about 75% when sanding. I wonder if that’s too high and could have contributed to the failure? 

[Chestnut]

12 hours ago, Coop said:

I have my CT 26 set at about 75% when sanding. I wonder if that’s too high and could have contributed to the failure? 

I usually have mine set to the lowest level. That could have contributed.

[legenddc]

On 12/10/2021 at 8:08 PM, Chestnut said:

So I've had my ETS EC 150/3  for nearly 5 years. In those 5 years it has served me well. With my hand plane usage I don't use my sander as often as most and have only gone through about 100 sheets of paper. I have only ever bought a 100 pack of 120 grit and a 100 pack of 180 grit and both are about half full yet. Just yesterday I noticed something funky with my cord. I looked at the end and noticed that there was a pin missing from inside the sander that got lodged in the end of the detachable cord. My first thought was the inconvience of having to ship the sander for repair and the time lost with out it with Christmas coming up fast.

Man, the fact that you've only gone through 100 sheets of sandpaper with the amount that you build is impressive. You just use the hand plane and go straight to finish? How does it compare with the finish and time to plane vs sand?

I despise sanding and how many hands get tingly after a while. Was thinking of upgrading to a Festool sander (and still might) but cutting down the amount of sanding needed sounds pretty nice.

[Chestnut]

3 hours ago, legenddc said:

You just use the hand plane and go straight to finish?

Yes and no, it depends and I'll give examples. For a species like cherry and walnut that take hand planing really well and I only use clear finishes on I go from plane to finish. For species like hard maple or highly figured woods I'll tend to use a card scraper and then hit them with 180 grit.

I'm working with hard maple right now and the panels are 24" wide. Too wide for planer and not really fun to move through the drum sander so i spent some time getting the #4 sharp and am going from glue up to finish surface.

For something like the image below where it's the side of a small case it's hard to get the right grain orientation to get a smooth planed finish so I use the hand plane to flatten the side. Once i get my sander fixed I'll smooth this with 180 grit. First image shows burning and there is some slight misalignment. Sanding this out may not leave a nice flat surface it could be wavy.

With a handplane i can get it perfectly flat, ok well not perfectly flat but racking light won't show a wavy surface, but it's not really finish ready smooth because i planed perpendicular to the grain.

3 hours ago, legenddc said:

How does it compare with the finish and time to plane vs sand?

So the #1 thing to consider is are you going for 100% magnifying glass perfect result or will you accept some level of surface defect. I almost always have a tiny bit of tear out somewhere that I just don't stress over and accept. There may be a plane mark or 10. Don't mistake that as thinking there are gouges or chunks missing 99.9% of people won't notice. Heck there are some woodworkers that probably wouldn't look close enough to notice. Most of this is from seeing true museum quality antique furniture and noticing that they all have some level of surface defects, tear out, plane tracks etc. It's minor and hard to see but it's there.

I feel there is a time savings, even if there may not be. I don't hate every second of planing a surface so the task is more enjoyable. Even if it was the same amount down to the fraction of a second planing still seems faster. I'd say on specific project parts planing is faster, but it depends. Things like edges or legs I can take 1 or 2 full length swipes and go from rough to finish ready in seconds. Table tops take a bit more time as you have to work the high spots down and work around trick grain. Add in sharpening and slight plane maintenance I'd say it's a wash time wise. The big benefit is not rounding edges, plans keep edges square and flat.

The best benefit to planing is having a boat load of grill starting material and campfire starting material .

[RichardA]

On 12/12/2021 at 2:49 PM, Chestnut said:

Yes and no, it depends and I'll give examples. For a species like cherry and walnut that take hand planing really well and I only use clear finishes on I go from plane to finish. For species like hard maple or highly figured woods I'll tend to use a card scraper and then hit them with 180 grit.

I'm working with hard maple right now and the panels are 24" wide. Too wide for planer and not really fun to move through the drum sander so i spent some time getting the #4 sharp and am going from glue up to finish surface.

For something like the image below where it's the side of a small case it's hard to get the right grain orientation to get a smooth planed finish so I use the hand plane to flatten the side. Once i get my sander fixed I'll smooth this with 180 grit. First image shows burning and there is some slight misalignment. Sanding this out may not leave a nice flat surface it could be wavy.

With a handplane i can get it perfectly flat, ok well not perfectly flat but racking light won't show a wavy surface, but it's not really finish ready smooth because i planed perpendicular to the grain.

So the #1 thing to consider is are you going for 100% magnifying glass perfect result or will you accept some level of surface defect. I almost always have a tiny bit of tear out somewhere that I just don't stress over and accept. There may be a plane mark or 10. Don't mistake that as thinking there are gouges or chunks missing 99.9% of people won't notice. Heck there are some woodworkers that probably wouldn't look close enough to notice. Most of this is from seeing true museum quality antique furniture and noticing that they all have some level of surface defects, tear out, plane tracks etc. It's minor and hard to see but it's there.

I feel there is a time savings, even if there may not be. I don't hate every second of planing a surface so the task is more enjoyable. Even if it was the same amount down to the fraction of a second planing still seems faster. I'd say on specific project parts planing is faster, but it depends. Things like edges or legs I can take 1 or 2 full length swipes and go from rough to finish ready in seconds. Table tops take a bit more time as you have to work the high spots down and work around trick grain. Add in sharpening and slight plane maintenance I'd say it's a wash time wise. The big benefit is not rounding edges, plans keep edges square and flat.

The best benefit to planing is having a boat load of grill starting material and campfire starting material .

I have a woodstove in the shop.  Off cuts, plane shavings, dust, all burn.  I have a bunch of Cedar off cut's from a casket project, that I don't even need any starter .  

[Coop]

As much as you like cedar, I can’t imagine you burning even the smallest pieces. 

[RichardA]

On 12/12/2021 at 9:06 PM, Coop said:

As much as you like cedar, I can’t imagine you burning even the smallest pieces. 

It's time you put down the shot glass.

[legenddc]

Thank you for the detailed writeup.

I can see it being species specific. Most of what I do has been with walnut and cherry so it seems like it could work. Unfortunate to hear that a 24” panel is difficult to use with a drum sander but that makes sense.

I’m hoping to go to a museum next week and see some furniture but I have to convince the 6 year old to go with me. I even with sanding there are times where there are defects and tear out, it happens. Most people seem to not pay attention to details unless they’re truly interested. I’m embarrassed about some of my old projects that we sold to make room for a new one but the buyers didn’t notice/care, even if I pointed it out to them.

Sounds like it’s about a wash time-wise to plane but it’s more enjoyable so it goes quicker. I think that alone might be worth it. I’ve rounded over enough skinny objects edges with the ROS that I’ve sworn to not use it again for them.

There’s been a number of times when I’ve thought using hand tools would speed things up and I think it’s about time to take the plunge and start getting some hand tools, sharpening equipment and experience with them.

[Chestnut]

1 hour ago, legenddc said:

There’s been a number of times when I’ve thought using hand tools would speed things up and I think it’s about time to take the plunge and start getting some hand tools, sharpening equipment and experience with them.

Sharpening is a hurdle. Get a strop and compound regardless of what avenue you choose to sharpen. Some hate them and swear the ruin edges but I haven't experienced that unless i abuse the strop. Doing the maple panel I'd notice a bit of tear out, I'd hit the plane iron on the strop and the tear out would disappear. For reference on a 24" x 30" panel I'd strop 1-2 times from start to finish so it's a frequent task. Easier woods like cherry and walnut I strop less frequently unless there is figure.

Oh another important note card scrapers are a hand plane's best friend. If I hit some figure, and get some tear out the card scraper makes it disappear quick or at least a lot less noticeable.

I sharpen once a year maybe once every 12-18 months. Stropping kind of rounds the edge so it'll get to the point where the edge stops engaging with the work. It took me 3 years to do that with my most used #4 so i just sharpen more frequently before I have issues.

[Chestnut]

I got the new part for the sander yesterday. It installed in 30 seconds and the sander is running again. So now i can finish sand the 2 cases I'm working on.

[JohnG]

My Ridgid ROS kicked the can so I gave up on my local shop (where I’ve been on the waiting list for an ETS EC 150 for months) and ordered one from Rockler. Due to arrive next week! Glad to see that there is at least some repairability on these. 

[Chestnut]

On 12/12/2021 at 11:24 AM, legenddc said:

How does it compare with the finish and time to plane vs sand?

Circling back to this conversation. I finally had some decent bright racking light to be able to show the surface finish i get on hard maple with the hand plane. I can get much better than this on walnut and cherry, hard maple is a pain.

In the center of the image below you can see some of the plane tracks. With out the racking light these aren't visible but if your paying attention and feeling with your fingers they are perceptible. The lines run top left to bottom right in the image.

Below shows some of the more stubborn tear out that I attacked with a card scraper to some extent before stopping. I didn't want to leave an obvious dish in the surface.

If your on a smaller screen its the darker spot in the middle top of the image. It's about 1" x 1" square. There are a couple spots of tear our surrounding it as well that are very small.