Popular Post gee-dub Posted July 23, 2017 Popular Post Report Share Posted July 23, 2017 Bandsaw drift came up in another thread. I am on 'light duty' for a spell and seem to redirect all my energy normally spent in the shop toward talking way-too-much so, I started a new thread to talk about it. It might be luck but, my saws and Dad's saws all do fine with blade changes after doing this. Before I start, I aligned the fence to the miter slot. This assures that the 'fence/fence rail' and miter slot are perpendicular. Also the wheels are adjusted to co-planer and I do all that other 'unnecessary' stuff (tires are good, bearings are good, any random vibration has been cured) prior to this 'blade to table/fence' alignment. I use a hard, reasonably flat steel rule. I use the widest blade that I have, mounted and tensioned as if for use (this is just a 1/2" but, I am operating one-eyed today so forgive me for not swapping blades) and stick a rare earth magnet onto it behind the teeth. I stick the rule to the magnet (I know, really scientific). I then use a couple of 1-2-3 blocks (you could use milled wood blocks or anything reasonably reliable) and slide the fence/blocks up near the rule and lock it down. I loosen the table at the trunnions and nudge it (and thereby nudge the fence rails and locked fence) into decent parallelism with the rule. I can now slide the fence/block even closer and continue my precision nudging until the rule just touches the blocks. I tighten the trunnion bolts and re-check. Re-adjust if necessary. I find that following this effort I can grab any blade. And I only have to adjust the guides and tension for the difference in blade width. Once things get to be 1/8" thick or more I put the keeper between the fence and blade. For thinner stuff I slice it from the blank's outer edge, not between blade and fence. This slice is about 1/64", was fed by hand and taken from the small blank shown. I do need to make allowances for the kerf on blades designed for different purposes but, I haven't re-adjusted my fence since I setup the saw. This slice is about 3/32" and 6" tall. I did this with the well used Woodslicer that happened to be on the saw. I hope this helps others but, cannot stress enough how long I chased blade wander until I got my wheels co-planer. Maybe that was just a coincidence and what works for me may not work for you but, I have followed this method, right or wrong, on multiple saws with equal success. I do change blades for the job at hand so I am not one to put a blade on a saw and run it till it dies. I am also in the camp that readily discards or renews cutters that show signs of poor results. Having to remake a part of fix an error because I was unwilling to take a few minutes to swap a $40 blade got old for me a long time ago . 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan G Posted July 23, 2017 Report Share Posted July 23, 2017 Great info. Thanks for being on light duty and sharing all your great knowledge! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric. Posted July 23, 2017 Report Share Posted July 23, 2017 It's a clever adjustment solution, Master Dub...but you still have drift in your world...you just know how to easily resolve it. I use a different but equally fast system with a jointed board and a piece of blue tape and a pencil. You've probably seen it before. Works for me. So you've answered my question...I thought you were saying you didn't have to make adjustments after changing a blade, which would make you either the world's luckiest man or a big fat liar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric. Posted July 23, 2017 Report Share Posted July 23, 2017 1 minute ago, Mike. said: When people say "adjusting for drift" I think they mean purposely setting the fence to be not parallel to the blade in order to compensate for the saw's "drift". Like how I stand at a 30d angle to the tee on the rare ocassion I cave to peer pressure and step foot on a golf course. Not parallel with the blade? You mean not parallel with the miter slot? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric. Posted July 23, 2017 Report Share Posted July 23, 2017 13 minutes ago, Mike. said: no the blade. Well how the hell would that help anything? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodbutcher Posted July 23, 2017 Report Share Posted July 23, 2017 Ok, im not understanding. Probably because ive never owned a bandsaw, but what does blade drift and fence alignment have to do with each other? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric. Posted July 23, 2017 Report Share Posted July 23, 2017 1 minute ago, woodbutcher said: Ok, im not understanding. Probably because ive never owned a bandsaw, but what does blade drift and fence alignment have to do with each other? If your fence is not parallel to the natural path your blade creates, the board will pull away from the fence and you won't have a straight cut. The board pulling away from the fence is drift. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodbutcher Posted July 23, 2017 Report Share Posted July 23, 2017 3 minutes ago, Eric. said: If your fence is not parallel to the natural path your blade creates, the board will pull away from the fence and you won't have a straight cut. The board pulling away from the fence is drift. Thanks Eric. Im gonna need to buy a bandsaw so I can get a visual of this. And then learn how to correct it haha. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bleedinblue Posted July 23, 2017 Report Share Posted July 23, 2017 9 minutes ago, Eric. said: If your fence is not parallel to the natural path your blade creates, the board will pull away from the fence and you won't have a straight cut. The board pulling away from the fence is drift. I think that Mike is saying that he, or he thinks others, sets the fence parallel to the natural cutting path of the blade even if that natural cutting path is not parallel to the blade when stationary. That made more sense in my head than in print. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brendon_t Posted July 23, 2017 Report Share Posted July 23, 2017 42 minutes ago, bleedinblue said: I think that Mike is saying that he, or he thinks others, sets the fence parallel to the natural cutting path of the blade even if that natural cutting path is not parallel to the blade when stationary. That made more sense in my head than in print. I've seen a few people who do this and personally don't find anything wrong with it conceptually. This obviously wouldn't work well on a table saw as the plate is so wide but with a 1/2" blade, if it wants to cut on a straight line that is slightly different than parallel with the mitre slot, I don't see a problem slightly racking the fence to accommodate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric. Posted July 23, 2017 Report Share Posted July 23, 2017 48 minutes ago, bleedinblue said: I think that Mike is saying that he, or he thinks others, sets the fence parallel to the natural cutting path of the blade even if that natural cutting path is not parallel to the blade when stationary. Yeah that's how I interpret setting your fence for drift. The relationship between the fence and blade with the blade at rest means diddly...only what happens when you're cutting. I don't know, everyone has their own bandsaw quirks...it's a quirky machine. If you can resaw a 12" wide board, you've done it right. If you can't, you did it wrong. Whatever gets you there is the right way to do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gee-dub Posted July 23, 2017 Author Report Share Posted July 23, 2017 I often avoid discussion on snipe, drift, Saw Stop and Festool. The conversation can get pretty lively . Again, I emphasize that part of the value of a forum is the broad range of info from a broad range of woodworkers. The guy from Popular Woodworking can say about snipe that "There is no way around it. It cannot be eliminated" but, I prefer to adjust it out of my life. Since I have little to do but sit around I decided to go the extra mile. I hope this isn't a bad decision because I am not trying to be contrary, we all have differing shops, tools and experiences. Changing only the tension and guides on the saw I made approximately the same cut with Ellis 1/4", Woodslicer 1/2" and a Timberwolf 3/4" blades. I used a feather board to try to increase the reliance on the fence and table as reference surfaces. There is some additional roughness to the cuts where I stopped the feed to take pics but generally this is is how it works for me. It is not a rare species of worm-wood. It is just a piece of scrap that used to have toggle clamps screwed to it for template routing something or other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric. Posted July 23, 2017 Report Share Posted July 23, 2017 Holy crap, Master Dub. I thought I was the only one on the planet who knew about Firesign Theater. Wow. That brings back memories. Surrounded by a thin, thin, thin, 16mm shell...and inside, it's delicious! That's Arnie's whole beef halves. We deliver! LOL Those were some serious goofballs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unknown craftsman Posted July 24, 2017 Report Share Posted July 24, 2017 @gee-dubLooks good to me Gee Dub what size bandsaw is that.Do you tension the blade with saws scale? Or a gauge that clamps on the blade. I like he magnet and ruler trick, i would have thought of that eventually. Aj Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gee-dub Posted July 24, 2017 Author Report Share Posted July 24, 2017 37 minutes ago, Aj3 said: @gee-dubLooks good to me Gee Dub what size bandsaw is that.Do you tension the blade with saws scale? Or a gauge that clamps on the blade. I like he magnet and ruler trick, i would have thought of that eventually. Aj That is the very common Grizzly G0513 series. Mine is a 'tweener' offered for a while as the G0513X. Reviewers pointing out that one of the only flaws they could find with the saw was that it didn't have cast iron trunnions . . . Enter the G0513X2; same saw, CI trunnions. I have been very lucky with this saw. Once setup it has done nothin' but work. After I'd run it a few years, Dad bought one too . . . his is the G0513X2. I use the flutter method to tension steel blades and have since long before I had this saw. The saw performs pretty much the same regardless of guide positions. I have even run the saw for a few cuts after a blade change before I realized that I had never re-engaged the guides . . . not recommended at all . I'm sure as soon as I did something that relied on the guides I would have immediately been made aware of my oversight. I now have a more formal process that helps me complete the blade change without wandering off or having some other sort of senior moment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unknown craftsman Posted July 24, 2017 Report Share Posted July 24, 2017 I looked up your saw on Grizzys site it's says a 17 inch wheel.The specs also list two blade speeds 1700 and 3500 how is that done? I once ruined a perfectly cutting Resaw King doing something that was mentioned in another thread.That pretty much changed my bandsaw protocol.Setting the guide are very easy to over look. Aj Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gee-dub Posted July 24, 2017 Author Report Share Posted July 24, 2017 Speed change is via a stepped pulley. Not a quick, convenient changeover but, possible. This would be to setup the saw for a specific use. The lower speed is described in the manual "Slower blade speeds generally produce better results when cutting hardwoods, intricate curves, or when an exceptionally smooth cut is desired." I'm not sure how the slower speed gives you a smoother cut but, this could just be an inexperienced area for me. At any rate, with all that is involved, it is not something I would do on a whim. The importance of this feature probably varies with how you intend to use the saw over time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom King Posted July 24, 2017 Report Share Posted July 24, 2017 I have three bandsaws. The 12" Craftsman/Rikon/severalotherbrandnamesjustlikeit has drift probably no matter what. I never even put the fence on that one. The 14" old Delta, with riser, and probably every other upgrade available, including a 1-1/2 hp Baldor can have the drift tuned out of it, but it won't stand much moving, and keep perfectly tuned. In short, almost more trouble than it's worth to try to get all drift out of it. The 24" Centauro, from the mid '90's, that I'm at least the third owner of, doesn't drift, no matter what. I know the second owner that I bought it from rolled it several hundred yards to his shop, down the hill from the guy he bought it from, on it's casters. I drug it into the back of my truck with a come-along, and hauled it a couple of hundred miles on its spine. When i was setting it up, I noticed the big bolts holding the wheels in alignment. There is a placard near these bolts that says don't do any adjusting, it's set at the factory. The original paint still covers the nuts, and bolt heads of these bolts. It runs dead true. I have done nothing but put new tires on it, and a new blade. It will properly tension a .035 thick 1" blade. It does not drift, no matter what. The limit to its operation efficiency is how fast I can physically push a board through it. With a 1" Woodmaster carbide tipped 1.3 tpi blade, no matter how well tuned the 14" ever was, with whatever kind of blade, including a Resaw King, the quality of cut was never as good as this big boy with the fast spinning, big toothed blade. So my experience says some bandsaws are probably not worth the trouble to try to tune out drift, on some it can be done, but almost not worth the bother, and then when you get to a big enough saw, it's not something you have to ever consider. I appreciate this thread, because I'll use it to align the Centauro for when I use a fence on it. When I moved it, I took the table off, and just stuck it back on when I got home with it. The others, I won't even bother. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Randy Posted July 24, 2017 Report Share Posted July 24, 2017 It seems like everyone has their own way to setup a bandsaw for resawing that works for them and, if it works, great. Like other woodworking techniques there are some basic commonalities in everyone's methods. About 5 years ago I started to use the set of steps that Alex Snodgrass outlines as part of his Carter demos at woodworking shows. Since then I resaw without problems. YouTube is a good resource for a video of this setup process. There are a couple out there; one done in Marc Spagnolo's shop. Also, one of the things that Alex says is important is to dedicate a bandsaw blade to resawing rather than using it for curved cutting also. It's too easy to take the set out of the teeth by overheating the blade when going around sharp curves. This process, if completed whenever a new or different blade is installed, works for me. I now resaw without anger and frustration and get excellent results. It's not clear which of the steps are, in fact, the most important although Alex gives his view that one of the most important is getting the thrust bearing adjusted to support the blade only when pressure is put on it during resawing. Just thought I'd suggest something that works for me and only requires a relatively short setup period. If yours works for you, use it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gee-dub Posted July 25, 2017 Author Report Share Posted July 25, 2017 On 7/23/2017 at 3:41 PM, Eric. said: Surrounded by a thin, thin, thin, 16mm shell...and inside, it's delicious! That's Arnie's whole beef halves. We deliver! I love it when you can drop weird stuff like that out there and someone picks up on it. I knew we were kindred curmudgeons. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wdwerker Posted July 25, 2017 Report Share Posted July 25, 2017 I know remembering to set the lower guides after a blade change is frequently forgotten. I've used the slightly angled fence to match the drift when resawing for decades. My bandsaw is a 4 speed ! It's the metal cutting version of the 14" Rockwell/Delta. Heavier castings and a transmission. Fast speed for wood or pull out a knob to engage the transmission w 4 step pullies like a drill press for slow metal cutting speeds. Sliced up some 4" thick brass once. Metal cutting blade looks like a hacksaw blade. It's nice to have the stiffer frame but the metal cutting speeds rarely get used. Carter bearing guides, stronger Iturra spring, upgraded tension crank handle and a riser block kit plus a larger 1hp motor have it maxed out for a 14" bandsaw. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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