Bow Fronted Wall Cabinet...WIP

[woodbloke]

Back in the Spring, I was a pootling round a woodstore (as you do) trying to find some bargains (as you do) whereupon I spotted a forlorn lump of crown cut English Oak lying on the floor.  One side had been planed, but the other was completely black and infested with worm...not too promising.  When I got it back to the 'shop and passed a scrub plane over it, it didn't look too bad, still wormy, but not too bad:

 

 

So I flattened one side and left it over the summer to condition a bit more in the 'shop, then I made an mdf template, marked out the curve and proceded to plane the hollow with a modified, convex soled jack:

 

 

I soon realised that this was the hardest bit of oak I'd ever come across...is was even too tough for the worms as they'd only munched into the first 6mm or so on the hollow side.  After several hours planing, spread over two days, there was a considerable pile of shavings:

 

 

...on the floor and I was completely 'cream-crackered' ( and if my American friends don't know what that Anglo-Saxonism refers to it's the same as 'plum tuckered out'):

 

 

...but fear not, relief was at hand:

 

 

Carcase dovetails next - Rob

[Llama]

Very nice. I learned a new phrase today! 

 

I am looking forward to seeing more on this project. 

[TerryMcK]

LOL nice thread Rob. I too look forward to seeing more

[woodbloke]

Very nice. I learned a new phrase today! 

 

I am looking forward to seeing more on this project. 

Jacob's Cream Crackers = knackered (Cockney rhyming slang)...looks like you can buy them in the US as well.  A British staple, the same as Baked Beans - Rob

[Llama]

Well, it's the cats pajamas for sure.

[Bombarde16]

And now we know why the world needed a book titled "Hybrid Woodworking".  A table saw with a dado stack gets you in the ballpark and leaves you with enough strength to finish it using a curved jack plane.

[woodbloke]

And now we know why the world needed a book titled "Hybrid Woodworking".  A table saw with a dado stack gets you in the ballpark and leaves you with enough strength to finish it using a curved jack plane.

The problem here Rob, is that stacked dado heads are strictly illegal in pro 'shops in the UK and have been for decades so very, very few hobbyists here would ever dream of using them.  When you think logically about it...for good reason!    The other factor is that the underside of the wood was 'in wind' or twisted, so although one side was flat (the convex side) the concave side wasn't so even if I had the ability to machine out the underside before the wooden jack, it would have been impossible as I had no flat reference surface - Rob

[pghmyn]

That "cream-crackered" picture was hilarious. Do you have a picture that you are working from, or free handing this?

[woodbloke]

That "cream-crackered" picture was hilarious. Do you have a picture that you are working from, or free handing this?

Free handing, although there is a design...we aim to please!  - Rob

[G S Haydon]

Great stuff Rob. Very much looking forward to this. A perfect blend of timber, tools, project and smiles  .

[Bombarde16]

The problem here Rob, is that stacked dado heads are strictly illegal in pro 'shops in the UK and have been for decades so very, very few hobbyists here would ever dream of using them.  When you think logically about it...for good reason!    

 

Regrets, but we'll agree to disagree there.  Every tool in the shop is capable of horrific destruction (Lathe injuries, anyone?  Projectile knives off a loose shaper head?) and I see no logical reason to single out the dado stack as worthy of a total ban.

 

The other factor is that the underside of the wood was 'in wind' or twisted, so although one side was flat (the convex side) the concave side wasn't so even if I had the ability to machine out the underside before the wooden jack, it would have been impossible as I had no flat reference surface - Rob

 

So, make a flat reference surface.  In this case, you could adapt the sled technique that people use to run rough stock through a thicknesser without first passing it over a jointer.  Find a scrap of plywood that's a little wider than the board.  Attach two runners along the sides, essentially creating a catamaran.  Then attach the wayward board to the underside of the plywood (i.e. hanging in between the "hulls" of our imaginary cat) and run it over the table saw with the sled referencing against the fence.

 

Nothing wrong with vigorous exercise.  Apart from their utility in making projects, I use handplanes to blow off steam and get away from the world.  But, one of the nice things about woodworking is that there's always multiple ways to solve a particular problem.

[Chris H]

What makes a dado more dangerous than a normal blade?

 

You touch either, and well, your going to the ER.

 

They are extremely common in the USA.  I wonder why UK has stricter safety standards.  

[G S Haydon]

  I don't want to hijack Robs very interesting build but on machines and the tooling but I do  have this to say.

 

Since joining the forum back in February I have noticed significant cultural differences in attitude towards power tools and fixed machines. Sometimes this will mean the methods we use will clash. I've come to accept the differences but here is the why we have a different set up in the UK.

 

In the UK we have the HSE (Health & Safety Executive). The HSE is responsible for all health and safety issues in the UK from transport, construction, retail etc. The HSE compile data based on hospital data and the RIDDOR system (Reporting of Injuries, Diseases and Dangerous Occurences Regulations). Over the years, through data gathered, it was found that many accidents were caused on machines that were being used for procedures that could be done more safely on other machines.

 

With the task in question, from a UK perspective, it is deemed that grooving or any task that means a riving knife and crown guard is removed from a saw creates an inappropriate and dangerous situation and the task should be done on a more suitable machine. Most often in the UK things that are done on a dado stack would be done on a spindle moulder UK/Shaper US.

 

Other regulations also came into play in 1998 in the shape of the PUWER regulations (Provision and Use Of Work Equipment Regulations) which then also brought into force tighter regulations regarding machine run down time (broadly less than 10 seconds) and limited projection tooling with location pins or serations to prevent ejection amoungst other things.

 

All of these regulations based on accident stats within the UK created a climate where Dado stacks and the like became obsolete with no market place. The only place we would be likely to find these kinds of tools now would be secondhand e-bay. 

 

On unique jobs like this it's a hard call to what would be the fastest way of doing this as there are too many variables. One thing that is certain is that in the UK dado stacks are not an option. In the US you have more options. Different cultures, different legislation, different attitudes and different approaches. 

 

One thing is for sure, I'm eager to see this job develop. Based on Rob's portfolio it's going to be good 

[Byrdie]

I don't want to hijack Rob's thread either, but I do feel some sort of response is necessary.  Perhaps the moderators could move the messages specific to this thread to another topic line.

 

I'll keep it simple - if all safety regulations were based simply on statistical information we'd soon be outlawing cars, walking in the rain and kissing.  You can come up with your own list of statistics that might support that.

 

First of all, a dado cut is not a through cut making a riving knife or splitter unnecessary.  The guard on my saw is designed that it can still be used with the dado stack as well the built in riving knife is designed such that it can be used a lower height and with non-through cuts.  Since a dado is much wider, the riving knife would be irrelevant anyway.  Finally, even with your regulations in the UK, there is still nothing to keep an end user from removing or not using the riving knife, splitter or crown guard other than the risk of getting caught doing so.

 

The final argument I have is the same I raised on your video where you used a knife cut to register your saw cut.  The tool is only as safe as the person using it.  There are some people that should NEVER drive a car and some that should NEVER operate a table saw.  There are still others who will never be injured by either one.  I don't specifically have a problem with the government or it's agencies helping to regulate safety but I think there's some place for bringing back some value to common sense.

[woodbloke]

  I don't want to hijack Robs very interesting build but on machines and the tooling but I do  have this to say.

 

Since joining the forum back in February I have noticed significant cultural differences in attitude towards power tools and fixed machines. Sometimes this will mean the methods we use will clash. I've come to accept the differences but here is the why we have a different set up in the UK.

 

In the UK we have the HSE (Health & Safety Executive). The HSE is responsible for all health and safety issues in the UK from transport, construction, retail etc. The HSE compile data based on hospital data and the RIDDOR system (Reporting of Injuries, Diseases and Dangerous Occurences Regulations). Over the years, through data gathered, it was found that many accidents were caused on machines that were being used for procedures that could be done more safely on other machines.

 

With the task in question, from a UK perspective, it is deemed that grooving or any task that means a riving knife and crown guard is removed from a saw creates an inappropriate and dangerous situation and the task should be done on a more suitable machine. Most often in the UK things that are done on a dado stack would be done on a spindle moulder UK/Shaper US.

 

Other regulations also came into play in 1998 in the shape of the PUWER regulations (Provision and Use Of Work Equipment Regulations) which then also brought into force tighter regulations regarding machine run down time (broadly less than 10 seconds) and limited projection tooling with location pins or serations to prevent ejection amoungst other things.

 

All of these regulations based on accident stats within the UK created a climate where Dado stacks and the like became obsolete with no market place. The only place we would be likely to find these kinds of tools now would be secondhand e-bay. 

 

On unique jobs like this it's a hard call to what would be the fastest way of doing this as there are too many variables. One thing that is certain is that in the UK dado stacks are not an option. In the US you have more options. Different cultures, different legislation, different attitudes and different approaches. 

 

One thing is for sure, I'm eager to see this job develop. Based on Rob's portfolio it's going to be good 

Without the discussion degenerating into the differences between machining practices in the US and the UK, this is the reason that a dado head can't be used and that the riving knife/crown guard assembly on table saw should not be removed...at least in a professional 'shop.  Amateur or hobby woodworkers are under no such regulations but still usually adhere to current pro regs, though I do know of one of my friends here in the UK who regularly uses a stacked dado head, but's it's very rare.  Removing the riving knife/crown guard assembly in a UK pro 'shop is not an option as it's simply illegal...I used to work in a 'shop some years ago where the request was made to the boss and was instantly turned down.

The hollow side, which was 'in wind' was left like that as my planer-thicknessner bed (it's a Jet 260) will only accommodate about 250mm...the width of the board in question is nearly 300mm - Rob

[G S Haydon]

I don't want to hijack Rob's thread either, but I do feel some sort of response is necessary.  Perhaps the moderators could move the messages specific to this thread to another topic line.

 

I'll keep it simple - if all safety regulations were based simply on statistical information we'd soon be outlawing cars, walking in the rain and kissing.  You can come up with your own list of statistics that might support that.

 

First of all, a dado cut is not a through cut making a riving knife or splitter unnecessary.  The guard on my saw is designed that it can still be used with the dado stack as well the built in riving knife is designed such that it can be used a lower height and with non-through cuts.  Since a dado is much wider, the riving knife would be irrelevant anyway.  Finally, even with your regulations in the UK, there is still nothing to keep an end user from removing or not using the riving knife, splitter or crown guard other than the risk of getting caught doing so.

 

The final argument I have is the same I raised on your video where you used a knife cut to register your saw cut.  The tool is only as safe as the person using it.  There are some people that should NEVER drive a car and some that should NEVER operate a table saw.  There are still others who will never be injured by either one.  I don't specifically have a problem with the government or it's agencies helping to regulate safety but I think there's some place for bringing back some value to common sense.

 

Right with you Byrdie, I just wanted to out line the whys rather than rights and wrongs (not my job to do that) and I hope it did not come across as preachy. I really wanted to point out differences rather than right and wrong. I think we are all well equipped to select the best suited method we feel comfortable with.

[Llama]

This is very interesting. I never considered these differences. 

[woodbloke]

A little up date on this one. After the exertions of a couple of weeks ago in planing the bowed door, this cabinet has started to come together quite quickly (for me at least). Joints here have been cut and in the process of:

...being fettled to fit...and fit very tightly they do as well . Then the housings for the fixed shelf were cut:

...with the router and fixed fence, doing both together. Once all the jointing had been done, the cabinet was knocked together dry and the rebate for the back machined:

Then the fixed shelf was fitted into the housing:

The door was planed to a decent fit into the recess, with just the bare minimum of clearance so that the curve could be pencilled in, using the door as a template. The line to cut to was then easy enough to mark out about 2mm away, so that it could be roughly hacked to shape:

...with a chisel and brass maul. Assembled together, the cabinet's beginning to take shape:

It was then knocked apart and the inside surfaces scraped and sanded to 240g:

The profile of the door, inside and out was then sanded with a shaped cork rubber, starting of with a cabinet scraper and then 60g paper across the grain to refine the shape. All the other grits up to 120g were used along the grain and it'll be finally finished with 240g. Knife hinges were fitted this morning and by an absolute bloody miracle, they're about 97% spot on, with only the merest whiffle of a shaving or three needed to bring it true.

The back's been made (no pics) but it's just a standard oak frame with a 6mm quarter sawn oak panel set in a groove.

Comments, good, bad or indifferent welcome as usual - Rob

[..Kev]

Coming together nicely!  Very cool looking dovetails!

[G S Haydon]

A lovely Krenov flavor cabinet with fantastic WIP shots to boot. Well done that man.  

[Llama]

I am loving this cabinet!

[TRBaker]

Very nice, indeed.

[woodbloke]

After my horrendous cock-up (another good Anglo-Saxonism) in posting this update into entirely the wrong thread, herewith the second attempt, hopefully correct this time.

 

The first pic shows the back panel being fitted.  This is fairly straight forward...

 

 

...and is just a thin panel within an oak framework.  The interesting thing is that there wasn't enough space to make the slotted hanging hole(s)...

 

 

...so I glued on a little bock inside the rebate and then cut out a corresponding section from the frame.

 

The fixed shelf is biscuited onto the back panel and the convenient way to mark the position of the slots...

 

 

...was to insert a veneer pin (arrowed) into the dead centre of the biscuit slots, lop off the heads and offer up the panel.  When it's removed, there'll be two tiny indentations which will be the exact centre of the corresponding slots.

 

With the drawers made, it was time to fit them and the one of the factors in achieving a piston fit is to make sure that the rear opening is a fraction larger (no more than 0.5mm) than the front.  I used a...

 

 

...Richard Kell measuring stick to compare the front and rear opening distances.  I found that two distances were the same, so I used a bit of...

 

 

...120g sandpaper stuck to a bit of 6mm ply to open up the back.  Looks crude, but it works!

 

With the drawers fitted and the stops in place, I then had to determine the distance available for the handles.  All I did was to stick a blob of...

 

 

...mastic glue in the centre, offer up the door and squish the mastic.

 

 

Simply measure the amount of 'squish', take off 2mm and that's the height of the drawer knobs...

 

 

...shown above.  Some trial attempts on the left with the actual ones in Indian Ebony on the right.

 

These types of pieces are full of little fiddly bits to make.  The easiest way that I've found to hold them is to use...

 

 

...an engineers parallel jawed hand vice in the normal bench vice, with the door catch shown about to be cut with a Razor saw.

 

Final pic shows the rear panel being glued.

 

 

There are loads of cramps to hold it into the rebate but they bear on polished surfaces, so there are thick pieces of leather or cushion flooring (about 3mm thick) under the cramp heads.  Comments welcome, good, bad or indifferent - Rob 

[ChetlovesMer]

This is an awesome thread. Great project.

Fascinating aside on the Dado head.

I'm continually amazed at the stuff I learn on this forum.
Rob, one questions, you said you used loads of "cramps" were those cramps in your forearms, or does cramps mean something different in British than it does in American?

[woodbloke]

Chet - difference in syntax.  What you would call 'clamps' in the US are called 'cramps' by most people in the UK - Rob