shaneymack Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 "I am sorry!!! I had no idea I was hitting a nerve!!" No need to apologize Steve ! You arent the one that hit the nerve. "The one responder compared A Grizzly 3 HP table saw to a Sawstop 3 HP and at the risk of reigniting the brushfire, I would say that is a poor example as these (table saws) produce visible result" I disagree that this is a poor example. Ive owned cheap vacs and a festool vac and there is quite a difference. The festool is alot quieter. The auto start is a big one for me. The adjustable speed is very important when sanding as too much suction can compromise the quality of the sanding job. And of course the biggest difference being the filtration quality. Point is some would say there is not a big enough difference in cut quality between the sawstop 3hp and a grizzly 3hp to justify the difference in price, that was my point. I think that in the case of the Festool vac and the 3hp sawstop the extra cost is worth it and has the quality and features to justify the cost. I definitely agree that if you are only shopping in the 100$ range than looking at a 700$ vacuum must seem insane Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gee-dub Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 40 minutes ago, Llama said: Why does it matter... They just leak it out anyway... Oh, now you're going to start something . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Llama Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 1 minute ago, gee-dub said: Oh, now you're going to start something . I have to be good at something... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Edgar Posted April 13, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 21 minutes ago, shaneymack said: "I am sorry!!! I had no idea I was hitting a nerve!!" No need to apologize Steve ! You arent the one that hit the nerve. "The one responder compared A Grizzly 3 HP table saw to a Sawstop 3 HP and at the risk of reigniting the brushfire, I would say that is a poor example as these (table saws) produce visible result" I disagree that this is a poor example. Ive owned cheap vacs and a festool vac and there is quite a difference. The festool is alot quieter. The auto start is a big one for me. The adjustable speed is very important when sanding as too much suction can compromise the quality of the sanding job. And of course the biggest difference being the filtration quality. Point is some would say there is not a big enough difference in cut quality between the sawstop 3hp and a grizzly 3hp to justify the difference in price, that was my point. I think that in the case of the Festool vac and the 3hp sawstop the extra cost is worth it and has the quality and features to justify the cost. I definitely agree that if you are only shopping in the 100$ range than looking at a 700$ vacuum must seem insane The Shopvac that is sitting in the box is their 'latest and greatest'. And carries a 200 dollar tag, I'm starting to reassess my options as the overall quality of the Shopvac is now in doubt. Without creating another firestorm, how about Fein vacuums. I'm familiar with the brand more than Festool. What is the diameter of the suction hose on a Festool and a Fein vacuum? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaneymack Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 9 minutes ago, Rex Edgar said: The Shopvac that is sitting in the box is their 'latest and greatest'. And carries a 200 dollar tag, I'm starting to reassess my options as the overall quality of the Shopvac is now in doubt. Without creating another firestorm, how about Fein vacuums. I'm familiar with the brand more than Festool. What is the diameter of the suction hose on a Festool and a Fein vacuum? I think Fein vacs are quite comparable but once you go to the Fein turbo II HEPA you are basically in the same price range as the festool vacs. One difference is that the adjustable speed on the festool is controlled by the motor and the fein is controlled by a gate on the hose. Id prefer the festool one, when you slow down the motor you slow down the suction and you get noise reduction as well. The other thing to consider is the IF you are ever considering buying festool down the road you might as well just drink the koolaid now and get the Ct vac. Festool is very systematic in their approach and the systainers clamp onto their vacuums and their is also the boom arm attachement which is awesome. I dont think the fein comes with an anti static hose either. As for hose sizes, Festool comes in two sizes, 27mm and 36mm. Something else consider is festools warranty, which is 3 year and having dealt with them, they really take care of their customers. Food for thought... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minorhero Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 2 hours ago, shaneymack said: I wouldnt trust those ratings, I also wouldnt say that a ridgid would remove dust better. You will never get the level of filtration on a cheap shop vac as you get on the Festool vacs or on any vacuums at that level. Also, the auto start, adjustable speed, antistatic hoses, compatibility with the festool tools are all great features that you dont get on the cheaper vacuums. IF this stuff is not important to someone then I agree, its silly to spend that kind of money. You could make the same case for cheap tools in every category though. Grizzly makes 3hp table saws that are a third of the price of a sawstop table saw, again that is apples to oranges comparison. I belonged to a woodworking club that had quite a few festool tools including the full line of Sanders and 3 sizes of their vacuums. I used them for the better part of a year. Then I bought a house and could finally setup a permanent shop space of my own. I bought a ridgid ros and hooked it up to a ridgid vacuum. If more dust is being left on my work piece compared to the festool combo I honestly can not tell. Not saying this to be inflammatory. This is just been the reality of my observations. I don't just like cheap tools either, I own a new 3hp sawstop and it's definitely a lot better then my old 1950 unisaw in features and power. I don't see any reason to ignore objective ratings either. It seems to me that has to be the thing to focus most on. Festool vacs do have a really cool feature of turning on when the tool turns on. But I understand you can buy a plug for that. They have nicer hoses. I believe you can buy upgrade hoses for other vacs as well. They also are quieter, and there is no fixing that outside of wearing ear protection. The big ridgid vac claims to have 6.5 peak horse power which is a frankly meaningless number as peak hp is not particularly important. I can only think that what matters most is cfm and the ability to attach to machines. Festool has some proprietary hose attachments which work exceptionally well but its hardly impossible to attach machines to cheaper vacs. Rockler has been busy blowing up my inbox with dust right add-ons which I haven't tried but look quite promising. And Ridgids out of the box pressure fit plastic attachments work well enough to result in near as I can tell no difference in dust left on the workpiece. If there is a difference between the two it is so minimal that you would need both sitting side by side to tell that difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaneymack Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 8 minutes ago, minorhero said: 3 hours ago, shaneymack said: I wouldnt trust those ratings, I also wouldnt say that a ridgid would remove dust better. You will never get the level of filtration on a cheap shop vac as you get on the Festool vacs or on any vacuums at that level. Also, the auto start, adjustable speed, antistatic hoses, compatibility with the festool tools are all great features that you dont get on the cheaper vacuums. IF this stuff is not important to someone then I agree, its silly to spend that kind of money. You could make the same case for cheap tools in every category though. Grizzly makes 3hp table saws that are a third of the price of a sawstop table saw, again that is apples to oranges comparison. I belonged to a woodworking club that had quite a few festool tools including the full line of Sanders and 3 sizes of their vacuums. I used them for the better part of a year. Then I bought a house and could finally setup a permanent shop space of my own. I bought a ridgid ros and hooked it up to a ridgid vacuum. If more dust is being left on my work piece compared to the festool combo I honestly can not tell. Not saying this to be inflammatory. This is just been the reality of my observations. I don't just like cheap tools either, I own a new 3hp sawstop and it's definitely a lot better then my old 1950 unisaw in features and power. I don't see any reason to ignore objective ratings either. It seems to me that has to be the thing to focus most on. Festool vacs do have a really cool feature of turning on when the tool turns on. But I understand you can buy a plug for that. They have nicer hoses. I believe you can buy upgrade hoses for other vacs as well. They also are quieter, and there is no fixing that outside of wearing ear protection. The big ridgid vac claims to have 6.5 peak horse power which is a frankly meaningless number as peak hp is not particularly important. I can only think that what matters most is cfm and the ability to attach to machines. Festool has some proprietary hose attachments which work exceptionally well but its hardly impossible to attach machines to cheaper vacs. Rockler has been busy blowing up my inbox with dust right add-ons which I haven't tried but look quite promising. And Ridgids out of the box pressure fit plastic attachments work well enough to result in near as I can tell no difference in dust left on the workpiece. If there is a difference between the two it is so minimal that you would need both sitting side by side to tell that difference. Does the ridgid shop vac have hepa filtration? A big part of this is the quality of the return air back to your shop. I have no doubt that it has enough power to suck up the dust. In fact it probably has too much power without adjustable speed which is another reason it is less capable for sanding. Sure you can add/modify a regular shop vac to be somewhat like a higher end vac but you can put lipstick on a pig but its still a pig. Sent from my SM-N910W8 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minorhero Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 i dont know if the filter that comes with the ridgid is a hepa filter. But ridgid sells and even home depot stocks hepa filters for the ridgid vacs. I believe they run about 40$ for the larger vacs and the smaller ones are cheaper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 This thread is slowly talking me into a Festool DC. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodenskye Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 I have both shop vac/rigid models and Festool CT26. The Festool is quieter, works within the system and is my preferred. With that said, I use the shop vac for miter saw, general cleanup and other tasks I just wouldn't put the CT through, not that it couldn't do the job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SawDustB Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 If you're in Canada, I'd recommend the Duravac vacuums in the budget friendly shop vacuum range. I have one, and it's more powerful than the shop vac I had, but it's also QUIET. I find so many of the vacuums are unbearable without hearing protection, and this one isn't too bad. I've got the wall-mounted version along with a dust deputy, and it serves my needs for the moment (although I would still like a dust collector if I can figure out how to fit it in). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Rex Edgar Posted April 13, 2016 Author Popular Post Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 To all the Rev. Jim Jones on here..... I have sipped the Kool-Aid. CT26 will be delivered Friday. I fear this is only the first step of the madness as I will have to get tools to match the color scheme now....thanks a lot fellas!. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chestnut Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 11 minutes ago, Rex Edgar said: To all the Rev. Jim Jones on here..... I have sipped the Kool-Aid. CT26 will be delivered Friday. I fear this is only the first step of the madness as I will have to get tools to match the color scheme now....thanks a lot fellas!. So your signing the divorce papers then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Llama Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 Order a Rotex and a Domino while you're at it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaneymack Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 49 minutes ago, Rex Edgar said: To all the Rev. Jim Jones on here..... I have sipped the Kool-Aid. CT26 will be delivered Friday. I fear this is only the first step of the madness as I will have to get tools to match the color scheme now....thanks a lot fellas!. HAHA ! I love it ! My job is done here. If you have a ct26 you NEED some other Festools to go with it of course Let us know what you think of the Ct vac when you get it. You will see what I mean by apples and oranges VS a shop vac. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkinneb Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 8 minutes ago, shaneymack said: "You will see what I mean by apples and oranges VS a shop vac." LOL I agree calling a Festool CT a shop vac is like calling a Ferrari a car 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Edgar Posted April 13, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 Anyone know the name of a mortgage specialist.......think we're gonna need a second at least! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaneymack Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 Anyone know the name of a mortgage specialist.......think we're gonna need a second at least! Well since you're looking at getting a second mortgage, you NEED a domino ! Sent from my SM-N910W8 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom King Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 For what it's worth, I expect my guys put more hours on Vacs than any hobbiest ever will. I have two of the big Rigids, and one ShopVac that can take a bag. We have a half dozen or so of the Cleanstream Gore filters, some of which have been in use since 2007. We have that many filters so there is always a dry one available while ones that have been washed are drying. The ShopVac is only used for drywall, and plaster dust with the yellow bag when it's hooked up to the Porter-Cable pole sander. It works really well with that. I still wear a supplied air hood when I'm running the pole sander, but there is no dust on the outside of my hood, or on anything in the room when it's turned off. The yellow bag has to be changed after ten minutes of running with the 60 or 80 grit sanding screen, but it's done a lot of work by then. That rig has probably only been run for 10 to 20 hours total. Both do just fine for their uses. I like the Rigid better than the ShopVac for uses where we don't need a bag. One of those Rigids ran all day, every day, for a week in 2009. We're still using it. I get to deduct any money I spend on tools, but don't own a single Festool, or Fein or such. I wouldn't make any more money if the vacuum was green and black. We do little to no sanding on anything but drywall and plaster. We're in tall, old houses sometimes with 4 floors, so the extra bulk of a little cyclone is not worth the effort to haul up and down stairs. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Edgar Posted April 14, 2016 Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 12 hours ago, pkinneb said: LOL I agree calling a Festool CT a shop vac is like calling a Ferrari a car So now my Honda is junk too?! Where does it end? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minnesota Steve Posted April 14, 2016 Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 I had not seen that model Shop-vac before, so I looked it up. I like the way it sits on the ground with the wheels and such, seems less tippy. $200 seems like a bit much though when you consider there isn't anything else unique about it performance wise. The clear container would be useful for liquid pickup, but for dust I generally use a bag because it's a lot easier to clean out(I really hate cleaning the filter of dust) I have a 10 gallon contractor model I bought at Menards. It's powerful... 195 CFM, came with a 20' long cord, and a 12' long 1 1/2" hose which is very flexible(unlike most other hoses) Quality wise it's held up... the cord wrap is on top of the motor and I've had no problems. The "accessory" rack is on the back and that's a piece of garbage. I have an iVac automated switch... This switch is awesome for a lot of reasons... you can turn the vac on without a tool being on, and you can plug it in to two different outlets so the vac and tool aren't on the same circuit. http://www.woodcraft.com/product/149950/ivac-automated-shop-vacuum-switch.aspx Now the one problem, in retrospect I wish I'd thought of this. 195 CFM is too much for a single dust deputy. I ended up having to buy a second and put them together in parallel. My old vac was a 2.5 hp shopvac which was around 120 cfm and it worked great with the dust deputy but it died after 8 years and I thought I'd get a more powerful one... and in retrospect I probably didn't need the more powerful one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkinneb Posted April 14, 2016 Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 8 hours ago, Paul Edgar said: So now my Honda is junk too?! Where does it end? Lol not at all we currently have three Honda's in our house and they do a great job, I'm just not going to compare them to a Ferrari 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Posted April 14, 2016 Report Share Posted April 14, 2016 22 hours ago, Rex Edgar said: To all the Rev. Jim Jones on here..... I have sipped the Kool-Aid. CT26 will be delivered Friday. I fear this is only the first step of the madness as I will have to get tools to match the color scheme now....thanks a lot fellas!. Well, I have no idea where you are located but if it's near Des Moines, Iowa - there is an auction on April 30 with Festool. It's a four hour drive for me so I haven't made up my mind. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Edgar Posted April 15, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 15, 2016 God Bless Jeff Bezos, CT26 arrived mid day and we got down to business. First impression is the packaging. Seems they want what's in the box to arrive unblemished. Only labor items are the cord bracket and installing the vacuum bag. Well designed, compact, well it is German engineering! Plenty of power, if the suction is restricted the Rockler dust separator threatens to implode. Looking forward to sawing and sanding with it in the next few days. Film @ 11. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaneymack Posted April 15, 2016 Report Share Posted April 15, 2016 Awesome ! You've popped your fes-cherry, congrats! Be very careful, a small taste and some have been known to become fes-sluts. They hang out on the FOG. Sent from my SM-N910W8 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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