Cherry Roubo

[Chestnut]

Yeah so I'm supposed to be working on dining chairs. My excuse was I needed to get material before i could progress on the project but in reality I really wanted to make something for my shop. So while i  waited for a chance to get a lumber order into my schedule I grabbed a bunch of the  8/4 cherry i got a good deal on.Why cherry? Because everyone does maple and I want to do something different.. ( I also got the cherry for a steal.

I didn't want to be wasteful with the lumber and the boards I had were odd widths. Everything was 7-7/8" wide which is frustrating. So i ripped half the boards I needed with 1 extra. I then took the too narrow boards and proceeded to make them wider. This is a bench not a piece of furniture so if some glue seams show up on end grain so be it. Odds are it's not going to be noticeable. The boards I laminated to get the needed thickness were placed towards the center. I also had some boards with heavy wane. I made sure that I coordinated them within the slab and used them as the picture below shows better than I can explain.

Yep there is a big void in the center of my bench towards the bottom. Do I care? Heck no! it's going to be buried inside the bench never to be seen what does it matter?

One of the boards had some really awesome figure. So I pulled one piece of that board out to make it the front laminate. The 2nd board was used as the show face of the rear slab. The board for the rear slab was a tiny bit thin so there is a piece laminated to the bottom. I tried to grain match it some and get a similar color board. In the end it's hard to tell and I'm happy with it.

After lots of milling and emptying this thing twice,

I got al the material for the slabs milled and together. I even used cherry dominoes for alignment.

I used Marc's hit and miss planing method to somewhat straiten the boards. This worked well and left me a LOT more material than he ended up with. I was able to do my rear slab with 6 pieces instead of 7 and my front is 4 pieces with a random stick of 3/4" thrown in for some extra width. While gluing the slabs together I was worried i was going to induce a bow. These boards were NOT strait at this point. I rotated them to offset as much as possible but in the end the chance that the slabs would be strait is low. SO i stacked the deck in my favor. Bent lamination uses a form to hold a curve the opposite can also be done. So i grabbed the front laminate strip and jointed it perfectly strait. I then rotated it and clamped it along both slabs during glue up and this will ensure that the side is strait and because all the boards are an even thickness everything is parallel.

In practice this worked just as well as in theory. My 52" veritas strait edge confirmed that these guys are laser strait. I used some winding sticks and confirmed that they were free of twist.

Holy !!!!! These things are heavy!

Next up is end cap and the mortise and stuff. I trimed the front slab to length and then cut the tenon.

I glued up some walnut that I scored of C_list a while ago for cheap. This stuff was some guys shorts, and were like 18" long and perfect for this. The color ended up being surprisingly beautiful. I cut the mortise in the end cap easy peasy. I extended the mortise and am setting my bench up to be able to come apart. I don't have the BC hardware yet and will probably use this bench for a while before I buy the tail vise. I'll buy the leg vise prior to completing the bench.

So I drilled the holes in the end cap and am using some 6" long spax screws to attach it to the front slab. Now the first big OH !@$(%! moment happens.

I realized I drilled the internal hole with a 1-3/8" forstner bit instead of a 1-1/2" bit. So taking a breath I grabbed a block of walnut because it's what i had sitting in the scrap bin. I drilled a hole all the way through like 1/16", this is the guide for the forstner bits. I drilled one side with the 1-3/8" bit and the other with the 1-1/2" bit. I used the smaller bit to line up the block on the outside of the bench. I fed it through the inside as seen below.

Once i had the block lined up on the outside I used the 1-1/2" bit to drill the rest of the way through the guide block and into the end cap.

After I got a good way into the end cap i took everything apart and finished the hole on the drill press to make sure that it was strait.

Next is the dog hole strip. After reading the part on this. I decided my time was worth more than the cool factor of square dogs. So I glued up three 3/4" pieces and made the dog hole strip. To get everything lined up I ran dominoes through all 3 laminations and into the bench. The dominoes were 65mm long and this worked flawlessly.

So here we sit. As i work through this I'll hit periods where glue needs to dry. I"m going to take that time to work on the templates for the dining chairs and get the bent lamination mold for the back rest started.

This walnut color is going to look awesome with finish.

[SawDustB]

Looking good so far Drew! I figured with the planer purchase this might be happening soon. 

[wtnhighlander]

That is shaping up to be one beauty of a bench!

[Chestnut]

Can't help it. I got end cap cut to length. Laid out the dovetails on the front laminate, cut on the band saw and transferred to the end cap. I routed out the first 1/4" and did all the chiseling.

I know people in the past have talked about how cutting these tails causes a bit of a pucker factor. So i dug out my short mortising bit. It's only 1/4" cutting length so it made the routing a lot easier of a process.

I still had to switch to a longer bit for the final cuts but getting a good 3/4" out of the way with the smaller bit helped. It probably also helped that I was using walnut. This stuff cuts like a hot knife through butter.

The fit isn't perfect but it holds the front laminate in place and looks good. There are a few gaps but i'll try and take care of those with sanding.

[Mark J]

Looks great, but I'm not sure how you pass this off as part of a dinning room chair.  

 

By the way, that was a clever solution on the Forstner fumble.  

[Bmac]

Looking good, and I like the fact that you understand this is a workbench, not a piece of fine furniture! What are you using for the legs, Cherry?

By the way, you can't put off those chairs forever. 

[Chestnut]

52 minutes ago, Bmac said:

Looking good, and I like the fact that you understand this is a workbench, not a piece of fine furniture! What are you using for the legs, Cherry?

By the way, you can't put off those chairs forever. 

Legs are goign to be cherry. The chop is going to be walnut or I might dig through some of the exotics i got in a package deal and veneer an exotic to the chop face or even the deadman. Despite it being a bench it's goign to be the focal point when you walk in my shop so i do want it to have some wow factor. The wow factor is mostly for myself.

[Bmac]

11 minutes ago, Chestnut said:

Legs are goign to be cherry. The chop is going to be walnut or I might dig through some of the exotics i got in a package deal and veneer an exotic to the chop face or even the deadman. Despite it being a bench it's goign to be the focal point when you walk in my shop so i do want it to have some wow factor. The wow factor is mostly for myself.

Sure, I get that, but in the end it's still a bench. If it doesn't look beat up and used in 10 years you are not really doing work on it.

Dog holes round or square? I went with round and am perfectly satisfied. 

[pkinneb]

Looks great Drew!! BTW it looks to be furniture quality to me

It's ok 3 years later I still love looking at my bench, I have no problem with furniture in the shop LOL

[Chestnut]

8 hours ago, Bmac said:

Sure, I get that, but in the end it's still a bench. If it doesn't look beat up and used in 10 years you are not really doing work on it.

Dog holes round or square? I went with round and am perfectly satisfied. 

Oh it'll look like a well used bench after a couple years.

I'm going round because easier. I think square are neat but a lot of dang work i don't need and won't appreciate.

 

[Mick S]

Really gorgeous bench, Drew! The cherry is nice and pink. Definitely furniture quality. 

[Chestnut]

For the Roubo builders out there. Is there any reason to have so much dead space under neath the bottom shelf? I plan on making under bench storage and am kicking around lowering the bottom shelf piratically to the floor. I know this will change the length of the deadman but I don't see any other reasons it wouldn't work.

Tell me if I'm missing something.

[..Kev]

27 minutes ago, Chestnut said:

For the Roubo builders out there. Is there any reason to have so much dead space under neath the bottom shelf? I plan on making under bench storage and am kicking around lowering the bottom shelf piratically to the floor. I know this will change the length of the deadman but I don't see any other reasons it wouldn't work.

Tell me if I'm missing something.

No reason other than your feet fitting under it while you're at the bench..  I lowered the bottom on the last one that I built..

[Chestnut]

3 minutes ago, ..Kev said:

No reason other than your feet fitting under it while you're at the bench..  I lowered the bottom on the last one that I built..

I didn't think of the feet thing. I placed a board under my current bench that will stop my toes from going under, lets see if it bothers me. If any one things of anything else let me know. As i see it, lowering the shelf just provides less space to store wood shavings and sawdust.

[wtnhighlander]

The rails of my 'roubo-inspired' bench are right at the floor, set back only about 1.5". Can't recall ever stubbing a toe, not even on the legs, which are flush with the top edge.

[SawDustB]

Not much downside, really. If I did it over I'd be tempted to put it about 3-4" from the floor for toes. I figure I'll end up doing something to organize under mine eventually. I'm following Marc's storage project, although I'm not sure if I want something that permanent.

I store stuff under the roubo, but I also lose stuff under there too. There were two squares buried in shavings under it.

One of the most useful additions I made for storage was to put a row of hooks under the overhang. It gives a good place for the things you need constantly, like a hand broom or mallet. It doesn't interfere at all under there. I also plan to add a couple 3/4" holes going left to right through the leg for storing taller 3/4" accessories like the Veritas surface clamp I use in the dead man.

[Chestnut]

I've been working on the bench and want to get it to a point where i have a decent setup to work on the dining chair. I'm really sick of the shoddy holding on my current bench so upgrading to something better is goign to be nice. The pipe clamp twin screw is a great idea for an inexpensive vise and could work well, mine was just implemented poorly.

First up is legs. I made the legs from the remaining off cuts from the slabs. I had 10 foot  boards that i used to make the tops so i was able to cut the ends off each board and have enough length to make the legs. Unfortunately there weren't enough wide boards to make the legs from 2 perfect 5_1/4" slabs. So i glued some of the narrower material together and kept the 5 wide slabs I had for the outer face and had laminated faces for the inner leg.

I changed the rails a bit and the end rails i used 6/4 material. To adjust a bit i went with 1/2" mortise instead of 5/8 and had to move it closer to the edge. I will not be doing knock down anything so all M&T will be glued (epoxy or yellow, probably epoxy to fill voids). When routing the mortises my 1/2" bit wasn't long enough so i bought a new whiteside bit. For what ever reason the bit hated me. Typically i plunge the ends of the mortise and then clean out between. I got half way through and the bit started to grab when plunging. I'd get about an inch in and BAM. After soiling my pants 5-6 times i got the short mortises done.

I don't know what the problem was but i had NO interest in repeating that so for the long rails i switched to the domino. I measured the glue face for the tenons and got 8 sq in for glue area on the integral tenons. I did a rough calc on how many floating tenons I'd need to match the same glue area. If i make the mortise 28mm deep and each tenon is a little over 1" wide each floating tenon would be 2 sq inches of glue area so 4 would give me the same glue area. 28mm is 1.1" and the stock was closer to 1.25" wide so i got more glue area this way. The down side is I probably can't draw bore but i wasn't goign to do that any way. I used 8/4 stock for the long rails though i could have fit all these tenons in 6/4.

This felt MUCH safer to me and being that i got a cleaner better mortise the strength can only be better. My current bench and out feed table aren't built this well and they've held up just fine.

I cut the tenons on the short rails with the dado stack. To clean up and fine tune the faces i used my trusty LN 140 skew rabbeting block plane. Yeah a router plane is probably the idea tool but the rabbeting block plane is FAST and i can get the whole 2" tenon in 1 swipe.

Next up was the mortise and holes for the leg vise hardware. I don't have a 2_3/4" forstner bit so i did the relief for the bushing with a home made circle guide. I have a 2_3/4" hole saw and made a template and used my trusty 1/4" mortising bit.

The 1/4" cutting length isn't enough to get the full 1/2" so i removed the template and used the edge created to finish the depth. I had trouble seeing where the edge was. I wanted to be able to relieve some material so nothing would grab and run away. I found that if you trace the outline of the inside of the hole it makes seeing the edge really easy. it's not easy to see but the front face of the leg vise is actually 3 boards glued together.

Routing the long mortise for the crisscross was pretty easy. I got everything set up for both the leg and the chop.

I deviated from Marc's plans again on the chop. I really didn't see the need to use 9" wide stock and waste 4" of most of the length. I had a nice 5" wide 15" long cutoff from making the top. So i grabbed a 6" wide board and milled it up. after i had the mortise routed and the holes drilled for the screw and cross cross pin I glued 2 2" wings on the top to get 10" wide. This saved me from having to cut into the only board i had that was over 7" wide. The board was 10' x 13" 8/4 and it seemed stupid wasteful to cut into that.

After the glue dried i used some curves to cut a shape into the chop so it wasn't just square. Next is to get the thickness needed. I wanted to use some curly cherry for this part as well why not. I had a particularly interesting board from a batch of wood i bought. It ended up being the perfect width and length so it seemed like it was destined for the chop.

Oh it also looked quite nice.

Currently i have the BC leg hardware on it's way to my door. I also purchased a twin turbo vise from Andy Klien. In the future I'll buy and install the tail vise but it's not a priority currently. Despite what BC claims i don't see the tail vise being the imperative first vise to buy.

[Minnesota Steve]

Nice.   I really like working with cherry.   It's not too hard, it's not too soft... has a tendency to burn but as long as you keep things moving that can be avoided.   And it just looks gorgeous with a clear oil finish.

I'm not so sure about the tail vise.   I bought this Veritas inset vise, and I used it occasionally, but I really think I'd be better served with simple holdfasts and keep meaning to order a pair of those Gramercy ones.

 

 

I wish I had a secret stash of cherry... I've only got a few boards left from my last Youngblood trip and now they're closed.

[Chestnut]

3 hours ago, Minnesota Steve said:

I wish I had a secret stash of cherry... I've only got a few boards left from my last Youngblood trip and now they're closed.

If you are a guild member and can swing slightly larger orders the stock i got from Industrial Lumber was pretty good. Though this stash is from my last youngbloods trip when i bought every stick of 5/4 and 8/4 cherry they had.

[Chestnut]

I got the BC leg vise hardware in the mail today. Everything installed nicely so their dimensions were spot on. I took the steel plates that the criss cross mounts on and cleaned them with alcohol and then coated them in 3 coats of shellac to hopefully prevent them from rusting. I'll probably occasionally still hit them with wax though.

I unboxed the rest of the hardware to find the silly knobs they included. I promptly tossed them in their permanent storage receptacle. I'd have much rather taken a discount on the vise ........ instead i'll blast this on social media at BC in pure Midwest passive aggressive style.

 

[..Kev]

I haven't had any rust issues on the plates through 3 shops so, you're probably overkill there as I never treated mine with anything.  Nothing wrong with what you did though.

I am curious about the knobs..  I've ordered a few BC leg vise set ups and haven't seen these..  What the hell are they?

[JohnG]

8 hours ago, ..Kev said:

I haven't had any rust issues on the plates through 3 shops so, you're probably overkill there as I never treated mine with anything.  Nothing wrong with what you did though.

I am curious about the knobs..  I've ordered a few BC leg vise set ups and haven't seen these..  What the hell are they?

http://benchcrafted.blogspot.com/2019/01/about-our-pricing-in-2019-and-our-vise.html?m=1

There was a lot of backlash and many requests to have an option with no knobs, or pay extra for wood knobs, but BC just shot all of it down and said they would never do those things. 

[..Kev]

9 minutes ago, JohnG said:

http://benchcrafted.blogspot.com/2019/01/about-our-pricing-in-2019-and-our-vise.html?m=1

There was a lot of backlash and many requests to have an option with no knobs, or pay extra for wood knobs, but BC just shot all of it down and said they would never do those things. 

Interesting read, thanks!

@Chestnut, you could send those knobs to me..  

[Chestnut]

8 hours ago, ..Kev said:

What the hell are they?

Yeah the above blog post. For some reason the would only sell knobs that were infused wood which confuses me as hand plane totes and knobs see more abuse and hold up fine. I don't know why they didn't just turn knobs from cherry, maple or walnut.

I'm just going to turn some knobs from macassar ebony or bocote or well anything. Something wood is goign to be more pleasant to use than these things they feel really cold.

As a side note the thing that draws me the most to LN planes is that they use cherry for their knobs and totes. Not because i love cherry, which i do, but because it's a nice touch with out being garish like some exotics can be.

[pkinneb]

10 hours ago, ..Kev said:

I haven't had any rust issues on the plates through 3 shops so, you're probably overkill there as I never treated mine with anything.  Nothing wrong with what you did though.

X2 regarding rust issues but probably not a bad idea none the less.

1 hour ago, Chestnut said:

Yeah the above blog post. For some reason the would only sell knobs that were infused wood which confuses me as hand plane totes and knobs see more abuse and hold up fine. I don't know why they didn't just turn knobs from cherry, maple or walnut.

I'm just going to turn some knobs from macassar ebony or bocote or well anything. Something wood is goign to be more pleasant to use than these things they feel really cold.

As a side note the thing that draws me the most to LN planes is that they use cherry for their knobs and totes. Not because i love cherry, which i do, but because it's a nice touch with out being garish like some exotics can be.

That's what I did 20 minutes of work and now they match my bench