Popular Post Chris H Posted May 7, 2016 Popular Post Report Share Posted May 7, 2016 Well it's official! The new shop is underway. Materials are on site, and the site prep has started. It's going to be a long road ahead, but the wife can't stop it now! I have been doing tons of research on how to insulate the building, and to be honest, I can't find a whole lot of agreement other than closed cell spray is the only "good" solution and it is by far the most expensive. Anyone else have some experience with insulating a steel pole building? The goal isn't to keep is 100% climate controlled all the time, which I know causes some of the moisture concerns with fiberglass. We are in South Eastern Wisconsin, so we get a little bit of every kind of weather. My primary concern is more around humidity control than temperature, but we will have to deal with both. I have been working out of our garage since we started building the house about 18 months ago, and the volatile humidity is just hell on projects that take weeks to complete. Since I woodwork only semi-professionally, this has caused a lot of issues for me on different projects. Milled lumber that sits is always out of square, which is very annoying! As always, appreciate any advise. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chestnut Posted May 7, 2016 Report Share Posted May 7, 2016 Just do it right and closed cell foam it. I know you probably won't want to but then to control humidity you could keep the building conditioned on a more permanent basis for humidity control. Think about how long you'll have the shop and how much money it would save you in heating and AC bills as well as ruined project costs. It'll probably pay for the difference quickly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
..Kev Posted May 7, 2016 Report Share Posted May 7, 2016 I framed out the inside of my pole building and added batted R-19 to the walls. I've had no issues but, I also don't get your humidity here in WA. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaneymack Posted May 7, 2016 Report Share Posted May 7, 2016 Congrats Chirs, thats going to be awesome ! I would definitely spray foam the building. I would air condition the whole summer to keep the humidity down . For sure the spray foam is much more expensive but it is the best. If you plan on staying at this place for a long time and you really want to be able to control the interior temp/humidity this will be your best option. R value and vapour barrier all in one. Is that an Odyssey and an Accord in your driveway? We own the exact same vehicles, lol. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris H Posted May 7, 2016 Author Report Share Posted May 7, 2016 Does Anyone have any experience with DIY foam insulation? This would help with costs. Still much more than bat insulation, but would cut the cost approximately in half. Most of the reviews are positive, but it's people doing a small area. The a 1000 sqft shop,walls and ceilings, it would be a big effort. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaneymack Posted May 7, 2016 Report Share Posted May 7, 2016 1 minute ago, Chris H said: Does Anyone have any experience with DIY foam insulation? This would help with costs. Still much more than bat insulation, but would cut the cost approximately in half. Most of the reviews are positive, but it's people doing a small area. The a 1000 sqft shop,walls and ceilings, it would be a big effort. Don't do it. Get the pros in. They will be in and out in a morning and it will be done properly with consistent thickness everywhere and minimal mess. This is one of those thing you just got to bite the bullet and do... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chestnut Posted May 7, 2016 Report Share Posted May 7, 2016 I've seen the DIY kits used before for insulating the outside of manholes. It worked ok and did seem easy ( i was the engineer sitting and watching not doing). Though they ran into an issue where the tanks were spraying the same amount and the mix came out wrong. I'd hire it, quick easy fast and a product you won't have to worry about. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davestanton Posted May 7, 2016 Report Share Posted May 7, 2016 No help with the insulation but the property looks great. Make sure you keep the project to the standard it deserves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drzaius Posted May 8, 2016 Report Share Posted May 8, 2016 I think the DIY kits are OK for doing small spaces, but it would cost a fortune to use for a large area. Spraying foam, especially closed cell, is quite technical. Definitely something to leave to the pros. If your in an area where you have large swings in humidity and both heating and cooling seasons, closed cell is the way to go. Here in Alberta, fiberglass, mineral wool or cellulose with a vapor retarder on the inside works great & is economical. But we do not have hot, humid summers. I don't think you'll ever regret putting in good insulation.v Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris H Posted May 8, 2016 Author Report Share Posted May 8, 2016 On 5/7/2016 at 9:26 AM, shaneymack said: Is that an Odyssey and an Accord in your driveway? We own the exact same vehicles, lol. Yeah, we are a Honda family. Used to have a Pilot (favorite car ever), but had to get domesticated with the second kid. Dual automatic sliding doors are worth their weight in gold. Not sure how or why, we didn't do it sooner! Thanks for the feedback. I put out an RFP this weekend to get a couple more contractors in to quote the insulation job. Hopefully someone has a better price than the first estimate, or we are going to have to wait a year or two to pay for it. Last quote for spray was about 1/2 the price of the entire building. Seems kinda crazy! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjeff70 Posted May 8, 2016 Report Share Posted May 8, 2016 Gorgeous property. Looking forward to progress and hearing the details as the shop gets built. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaneymack Posted May 8, 2016 Report Share Posted May 8, 2016 Is that an Odyssey and an Accord in your driveway? We own the exact same vehicles, lol. Yeah, we are a Honda family. Used to have a Pilot (favorite car ever), but had to get domesticated with the second kid. Dual automatic sliding doors are worth their weight in gold. Not sure how or why, we didn't do it sooner! Thanks for the feedback. I put out an RFP this weekend to get a couple more contractors in to quote the insulation job. Hopefully someone has a better price than the first estimate, or we are going to have to wait a year or two to pay for it. Last quote for spray was about 1/2 the price of the entire building. Seems kinda crazy! Ya the odyssey is fantastic! With four kids, we couldn't be without it. We love the built in shop vac, it's so cool. Seems pretty odd that the insulation price would be half the price of the building. Definitely get a bunch of other quotes. They should be able to tell you over the phone how much per sq ft for X amount of inches thick on the walls. Then you can calculate based on your square footage of walls. Might save you some time. Sent from my SM-N910W8 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris H Posted May 11, 2016 Author Report Share Posted May 11, 2016 On 5/8/2016 at 3:07 PM, shaneymack said: Seems pretty odd that the insulation price would be half the price of the building. Definitely get a bunch of other quotes. They should be able to tell you over the phone how much per sq ft for X amount of inches thick on the walls. Then you can calculate based on your square footage of walls. Might save you some time. I have 3 bids now, and they are all coming in around $1.15/sqft @ 1". Unfortunately all recommend at least 2" of foam. So a 1,000 sqft shop has roughly 3,000 - 3,500 sqft of surface to insulate depending if you insulate an installed ceiling or spray right on the roof line. So with a 2" need for spray you are looking at $7k-$8k. The good news is this is about the same price as the DIY kits, so it's a no brainer to pay a pro. The bad news is that this is easily double the cost of less desirable alternatives, and on a $15k-$20k workshop, it's a big %. More pics to come once it stops raining! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
..Kev Posted May 11, 2016 Report Share Posted May 11, 2016 I framed in and used bat insulation much cheaper and did it myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaneymack Posted May 11, 2016 Report Share Posted May 11, 2016 Chris, forget the roof. Just spray the walls. Put up some 6 mil poly on the trusses and get a guy in to spray 14" of cellulose. It does a good job and it super cheap. Sent from my SM-N910W8 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brendon_t Posted May 11, 2016 Report Share Posted May 11, 2016 Yeah I honestly don't think I would be spending 1/3 the total cost in upgraded insulation. Until 4 months ago, I worked in an uninsulated garage. When is cold, a Hoodie is warn.. I installed bat insulation during the Reno. It was cheap and easy. Sure, maybe it's not top of the line of what's available but bats will insulate pretty well. Save the extra for the inevitable overages in building costs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tpt life Posted May 11, 2016 Report Share Posted May 11, 2016 Around here it is fairly common to spray 1/2" against the inside of the outer sheathing and against the top of the ceiling drywall. Walls then get stuffed with bats and attics blown. There is a little value in balancing the benefits of a mixed system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drzaius Posted May 11, 2016 Report Share Posted May 11, 2016 2 hours ago, shaneymack said: Put up some 6 mil poly on the trusses and get a guy in to spray 14" of cellulose. It does a good job and it super cheap. Or rent the machine & DIY. That's how I did my shop attic. Super easy & super cheap. Don't blow in fiberglass though or you'll be itchy for a month. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom King Posted May 11, 2016 Report Share Posted May 11, 2016 4 hours ago, Brendon_t said: Yeah I honestly don't think I would be spending 1/3 the total cost in upgraded insulation. Until 4 months ago, I worked in an uninsulated garage. When is cold, a Hoodie is warn.. I installed bat insulation during the Reno. It was cheap and easy. Sure, maybe it's not top of the line of what's available but bats will insulate pretty well. Save the extra for the inevitable overages in building costs. It gets cold in LA? I've been to Wisconsin when it's cold. THAT's COLD! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brendon_t Posted May 12, 2016 Report Share Posted May 12, 2016 9 minutes ago, Tom King said: It gets cold in LA? I've been to Wisconsin when it's cold. THAT's COLD! No, not really. We may have a week of 30's. I visit the forum on mobile so I don't see locations. I just figure even in the polar regions, people have used insulation that works way before foam. If it's in the price range, heck yeah. Go for it. If not though, I wouldn't feel bad about going with something tried and tested that doesn't land you in the poor house. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janello Posted May 12, 2016 Report Share Posted May 12, 2016 Hold the press.....forget what these nuckle heads are telling you about spray foam. I put up a 20×40 steel pole barn and installed R19 blanket insulation in the walls and ceiling. I used 6mil plastic as vapor barrier over that. That cost me around $1000. I installed a heat pump split system and I can work in my underwear in new jersey all year round in there. Save the 7k for tools! Heres what you do. Sandwitch the blanket insul between 2x4s and nail the face to your poles. Like hanging a big curtain. for the cieling if you can rent 2 520 lifts you can frame section and insulate it on the ground and then raise it up between the trusses and face nail it. You can find pics of my shop and estesbubba on here using the search feature...he did his the same way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drzaius Posted May 12, 2016 Report Share Posted May 12, 2016 7 minutes ago, Janello said: Hold the press.....forget what these nuckle heads are telling you about spray foam. I put up a 20×40 steel pole barn and installed R19 blanket insulation in the walls and ceiling. I used 6mil plastic as vapor barrier over that. That cost me around $1000. I installed a heat pump split system and I can work in my underwear in new jersey all year round in there. Save the 7k for tools! Heres what you do. Sandwitch the blanket insul between 2x4s and nail the face to your poles. Like hanging a big curtain. for the cieling if you can rent 2 520 lifts you can frame section and insulate it on the ground and then raise it up between the trusses and face nail it. You can find pics of my shop and estesbubba on here using the search feature...he did his the same way. Ya, it's easy for us to spend your money on foam. Batts will do just fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janello Posted May 12, 2016 Report Share Posted May 12, 2016 Talk to the people putting up the barn for you. Tell them you'll throw them some cash for thier slush fund if they got any spare insulation left over from other jobs. I got a whole pile of 2x4 and 2x6 and 8 rolls of insulation for $200 doing that. Even full price was under $1000. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toddclippinger Posted May 12, 2016 Report Share Posted May 12, 2016 Congrats on the new shop! This will be fun to follow! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dog boy Posted May 12, 2016 Report Share Posted May 12, 2016 I live in Saskatchewan, Canada and our yearly temperature range is from -40c to + 35C, or -40F to over 100F. I just insulated my 30 by 60 shop with 12 foot sidewall with 10 in fibreglass for less than $5000 Canadian. The quote for spray foam for 2 In was 25 to 30000. Mt fibreglass was R27 and the spray foam would have been less R value and required me to powerwash the walls of the shop first. IMHO spray foam is a nice one stop solution to insulating and sealing a small space but highly over-rated for larger spaces. Pink work works and is pretty cheap and easy for a diy-er. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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