..Kev Posted April 16, 2016 Report Share Posted April 16, 2016 The West Systems is thin enough to fill in without injecting.. Not sure what you're using.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodger. Posted April 16, 2016 Report Share Posted April 16, 2016 Or use a shoulder plane and trim them to fit to your liking Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Posted April 16, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 16, 2016 46 minutes ago, Pug said: Or use a shoulder plane and trim them to fit to your liking I am sorta trying that but I'm having some issues doing that. Though it just may be end of a long day type thing. 1 hour ago, TIODS said: The West Systems is thin enough to fill in without injecting.. Not sure what you're using.. Yup West Systems. Was only thinking of injecting it to keep it cleaner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
..Kev Posted April 16, 2016 Report Share Posted April 16, 2016 3 minutes ago, Cliff said: Yup West Systems. Was only thinking of injecting it to keep it cleaner. That's what blue tape is for 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Posted April 17, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2016 1 hour ago, TIODS said: That's what blue tape is for Yeah I thought of that like 30 mins after I posted my response. i'm a bit slow. In a bit of bad news, I'm going to have to redo the small countertop I made. I've determined it's mostly likely due to the temp when I glued the panel. It was 50ish to 55F degrees when I glued it and dropped as low as 30 that night. Maybe even 25. I used 207 WS. I didn't know until afterwards what temperature range to use it in. I also had no idea it would get that cold that night. If only there was some service that would tell me... Another possible option is because of my cletus wood. But I think the temp is more likely. Luckily I should have enough width to my panel to saw on the joint, then clean my boards back up and reglue. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brendon_t Posted April 17, 2016 Report Share Posted April 17, 2016 Did it bust on the glue line? If so, I would also point to being too cold or too much clamp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Posted April 17, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2016 13 hours ago, Brendon_t said: Did it bust on the glue line? If so, I would also point to being too cold or too much clamp. Yup glue line. Lesson learned Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Posted April 25, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 25, 2016 Slowly progressing. I got my second complete row glued up. Skipped the jig. It ended up not being as useful as I thought it would and it's actually easier to just clamp it like normal. Then I taped it both of them off and filled the gaps with epoxy. My second board was much better due to more proper finessing with hand tools. I think the third will be even better as well. Filled up. Still pretty messy. I'm also switching to table saw to make my lap joints. The router bit into the jig too much at certain areas and rendered it useless. I think I have corrected my original problem with the table saw, which is the squareness of my miter bar. However, It's going to be annoying to set the proper depth on this. However, I wasn't perfect setting the depth even with the router so I guess that is just how it goes. Maybe I'll get closer with the dado blade. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Posted May 8, 2016 Author Report Share Posted May 8, 2016 I cut up my short counter due to the glue failure, squared the boards, glued them back. Then I discovered my new favorite tool, using @Tom Cancelleri's advice on the Veritas variable burnisher. Holy crap it's amazing. However, there is still some staining and such from the epoxy and I'm sure it needs to be flatter, so next it goes through the drum sander when I can get it over to one. Officially a fan of card scrapers. Though I need to spend some time learning what angle to use for what. I just set it to 10 because that is what Tom did in his video and it sounded like it might be more aggressive. Perfect for this application. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brendon_t Posted May 8, 2016 Report Share Posted May 8, 2016 Busting the card scraper learning ceiling is a great feeling. I still remember the "aah Haa, these actually don't suck" revelation 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coop Posted May 8, 2016 Report Share Posted May 8, 2016 1 hour ago, Cliff said: I cut up my short counter due to the glue failure, squared the boards, glued them back. Then I discovered my new favorite tool, using @Tom Cancelleri's advice on the Veritas variable burnisher. Holy crap it's amazing. However, there is still some staining and such from the epoxy and I'm sure it needs to be flatter, so next it goes through the drum sander when I can get it over to one. Officially a fan of card scrapers. Though I need to spend some time learning what angle to use for what. I just set it to 10 because that is what Tom did in his video and it sounded like it might be more aggressive. Perfect for this application. Where might I find this video? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Posted May 9, 2016 Author Report Share Posted May 9, 2016 2 hours ago, K Cooper said: Where might I find this video? Hand Tools section, card scraper is the topic. Or I can just link it I guess. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coop Posted May 9, 2016 Report Share Posted May 9, 2016 Thanks Cliff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Posted May 14, 2016 Author Report Share Posted May 14, 2016 I came to a conclusion yesterday - why am I sticking with a giant 10' counter when it already has seams? There is no reason I can't cut it in half and put two pieces in. So that's what I did. Time to square the boards - yet again. First had to clean up my giant epoxy mess. I was very concerned that it would stain the wood so far that I'd have to plane it down to an inch or something. Luckily that did not happen. They turned out decent. I'm pretty happy with the "show" sides of the counter. Did my test fit, one board in particular was a super pain in the butt to get an edge that was straight enough to glue. I had to take it back to the jointer a couple of times. It was higher in the center of the edge than the ends, and somehow just seemed a lot harder to get straight. Finally I got it close enough that I am decently satisfied. There was still a bow in one of my boards so that it stuck up a little more than the others, but I figured my cauls would take care of it. So turns out my cauls suck. I got the idea of using unistrut from a lumber jocks discussion. It wasn't a discussion I was part of, just what came up when I went searching for alternative caul solutions that were cheaper. I can hearby confirm this solution - DOES NOT work. they flexed the same as any piece of wood that is clamped. The center board in my counter was able to move up and down freely. By the time I realized these crappy cauls was a no go, I couldn't really run back out to the garage to get clamps to get the boards perfectly even. I had some small c-clamps down in the basement so I used those to help out. It's still not bad, I think it will go through the drum sander well enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodger. Posted May 14, 2016 Report Share Posted May 14, 2016 For cauls I use poplar or maple scraps. I use them on edge if I have a particularly stubborn board, but normally on face works fine. Just make sure you cover the working face with packing tape, or in my case, tuct tape. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drzaius Posted May 15, 2016 Report Share Posted May 15, 2016 We use unistrut a lot at work, and no, it is not very rigid. Certainly not enough for clamping cauls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtnhighlander Posted May 15, 2016 Report Share Posted May 15, 2016 For clamping across long spans, it helps to put a slight taper on the caul, from center to ends. Keeps the middle from gettung loose when the ends are clamped tight. I like using soft wood 2x4 cauls, since they are less likely to leave pressure marks on a hardwood panel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pwk5017 Posted May 16, 2016 Report Share Posted May 16, 2016 On glueups where I dont have a lot of moving parts, I prefer to skip cauls and just use two clamps per seam. If you are confident in how you milled your boards, this process works very well. This was a big piece of a kitchen set, and i did NOT want to jerk around with flattening this thing through numerous drum sander passes. It was too heavy and long. So, I took my time milling the handful of boards, and glued them up using a clamp at every seam. I think all but 1-2 seams were 100% dead nuts on. The other two seams were 2-3 passes with my no8 and then on to sanding with 120 up. Doing a few of these grunt projects really makes you respect the glueup. If you F a glueup, you screw yourself so badly. Do it well, and you are rewarded beyond imagination. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodger. Posted May 17, 2016 Report Share Posted May 17, 2016 i did all the edges by hand on my counter top, and still used every clamp in the neighbourhood (and a zillion biscuits too)! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Posted May 17, 2016 Author Report Share Posted May 17, 2016 I agree on clamping the seams. I did that on the smaller counter and I think it's pretty flat with just some card scraping. I think I will personally never do cauls or biscuits again, as they just turn out poorly for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric. Posted May 17, 2016 Report Share Posted May 17, 2016 Joints. They're called joints. We're not sewing here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wdwerker Posted May 17, 2016 Report Share Posted May 17, 2016 Joints are what you use when you don't have a water bong ! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Posted May 17, 2016 Author Report Share Posted May 17, 2016 10 hours ago, Eric. said: Joints. They're called joints. We're not sewing here. Well the joint refers to the whole area that is glued. The seam refers to the top visible portion where end grain meets end grain. I've been referring to them as "gaps" as they were kinda large in some areas, other areas they may have been trenches. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric. Posted May 17, 2016 Report Share Posted May 17, 2016 3 minutes ago, Cliff said: I've been referring to them as "gaps" as they were kinda large in some areas LOL No, they're still joints. Seams are joints in fabric. "Glue line" is what you call a joint it if it's visible. Hopefully it won't be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Posted May 17, 2016 Author Report Share Posted May 17, 2016 2 minutes ago, Eric. said: LOL No, they're still joints. Seams are joints in fabric. "Glue line" is what you call a joint it if it's visible. Hopefully it won't be. There is technically no glue between the end grain portions. It just happens to be where two boards meet, the glue itself is on the long grain underneath. I think you are stuck on this sewing thing. Anytime two things meat in a visible line it can be considered a seam. Or not. I don't actually care. At my level of woodworking, the glue line is very often visible. But I turned it into a feature. Because I'm clever. And awesome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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