Llama Posted March 19, 2017 Report Share Posted March 19, 2017 Well friends, it's official. The Schwarz has spoken! Now you must all make Roman benches! We'll see what type of bench we need to make in the future. Or what sells more books... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post aknotsdeath Posted March 19, 2017 Popular Post Report Share Posted March 19, 2017 That dude annoys the piss out of me..... his whole shtick just seems fake and in general I don't trust guys with beards What about a guy with a beard and a cat? Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Llama Posted March 19, 2017 Author Popular Post Report Share Posted March 19, 2017 5 minutes ago, aknotsdeath said: What about a guy with a beard and a cat? Hard to look tough with hand lotion in the shot 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post aknotsdeath Posted March 19, 2017 Popular Post Report Share Posted March 19, 2017 Hard to look tough with hand lotion in the shot What can I say I'm married. Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mat60 Posted March 19, 2017 Report Share Posted March 19, 2017 17 minutes ago, aknotsdeath said: What can I say I'm married. Didnt no that was you. Nice looking beard. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post freedhardwoods Posted March 19, 2017 Popular Post Report Share Posted March 19, 2017 2 hours ago, Mike. said: .......... in general, I don't trust guys with beards I must be a pretty shady character using that standard. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freedhardwoods Posted March 19, 2017 Report Share Posted March 19, 2017 3 hours ago, Llama said: Well, friends, it's official. The Schwarz has spoken! Now you must all make Roman benches! I'll get right on that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post estesbubba Posted March 19, 2017 Popular Post Report Share Posted March 19, 2017 4 hours ago, aknotsdeath said: What can I say I'm married. Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk Which is why you need the lotion... 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denette Posted March 20, 2017 Report Share Posted March 20, 2017 I saw Schwarz on The Woodwright's Shop showing off a bench he designed by looking at a wall relief carving from some Roman ruins. If that's the same bench you're talking about, he can keep it. I like my mechanical advantages, thank you very much! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Llama Posted March 20, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 20, 2017 This one. 9 minutes ago, Denette said: Roman ruins Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wdwerker Posted March 20, 2017 Report Share Posted March 20, 2017 Looks quite suited for post Neanderthal technology. Might need that info for the zombie apocalypse ! Kinda glad someone is preserving the knowledge. Kinda glad it isn't me. Looks perfect for Tom Kings historically correct restoration work. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Llama Posted March 20, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 20, 2017 34 minutes ago, wdwerker said: Kinda glad someone is preserving the knowledge. I am too... I certainly toss a lot of crap at Schwarz... He gets it honestly though. I think some of it is his excitement for the next great woodworking discovery... The part that bothers me as it happens so often it comes across as disingenuous. Steve, you should look into the Mortise and Tenon books. They are full of information! (including this Roman bench)... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wdwerker Posted March 20, 2017 Report Share Posted March 20, 2017 I'll wait till they are in the bargain bin. Seemed pricey to me. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HuxleyWood Posted March 20, 2017 Report Share Posted March 20, 2017 In a world filled with content creator trendsetters Chris is a major trendsetter in handtool benches. His focus is on historical woodworking methodologies and this sparks a constant evolution of his bench design. Handtool purists often spend a lifetime in search of the perfect bench and generally go through many evolutions, Chris just feeds this desire with ideas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Jim DaddyO Posted March 20, 2017 Popular Post Report Share Posted March 20, 2017 I find Chris makes a lot of sense. He is a woodworker and a journalist, perhaps a historian and educator too. His woodworking is not always hand tools, and he says as much. On his journalistic side, he is pursuing his curiosity of the craft and it's history and is willing to take the time and make the effort to build living examples of what he discovers. Yes, he does go down rabbit holes with things, but that is his job. I have no issue with him being successful at it. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClassAct Posted March 20, 2017 Report Share Posted March 20, 2017 I welcome anything that helps our understanding of the craft. I too saw the Woodwright episode about the Roman workbench. Will I build one? Nope. Do I think it helps our scholarship about how one aspect of woodworking could have been done? You bet. As for giving someone grief because they've written articles and books about their passion, all I can say is "Go for it!" There's plenty of room in the world for more articles and books about woodworking. Writing for publication is a lot harder than it looks and we need all the successes we can get. (Spoken from experience, with 15+ books about software to my credit.) 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Immortan D Posted March 20, 2017 Report Share Posted March 20, 2017 20 hours ago, Llama said: We'll see what type of bench we need to make in the future. Or what sells more books... The Split-top Roman is the future. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Llama Posted March 20, 2017 Author Popular Post Report Share Posted March 20, 2017 40 minutes ago, ClassAct said: As for giving someone grief because they've written articles and books about their passion, all I can say is "Go for it!" That's not really my issue with him... I am all for spreading information. What I do find irritating is people seem to take his word as gospel. There are plenty of benches that break his rules, and people do just fine! Look at Maloofs bench, it's just a table with a pattern makers vise on it. Hardly a "real" bench. Frank Klausz has a bench that breaks almost every rule in CSs book. Shaker benches, well... Can't have storage in your bench! (unless your friends make the best vise on the market, then you chime in to give your "approval" for others to build their version) (not kidding, he did this in 2011)... There are plenty of people on here that make damn fine furniture with "crappy" benches. Mike is one of them, I don't think he even has a bench! And he can outbuild most of the forum. It comes down to one of my biggest pet peeves in woodworking. Just because a guy is on a podcast, or sells books does not mean they know what is best for any of us as woodworkers. Sure, there are some things that come down to common sense, don't sharpen your chisels on a brick... Most of my arguments on this forum have stemmed from someone talking to an "expert" and taking it as the one and only true way to enlightenment. I look at these "experts" the same way I do sports commentators. Two minutes after the Super Bowl ends, they are telling us who is going to win the next. They have no f-ing clue! But they do have to fill air time. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Eric. Posted March 20, 2017 Popular Post Report Share Posted March 20, 2017 I like benches and do think a good bench is a necessity if you use hand tools a fair amount, but I also think too much attention is given to them by new woodworkers when they should be focusing on learning fundamental techniques instead...not that a bench doesn't require a few of its own. Schwarz's fascination with them seems to be more from the historian's perspective than the woodworker's. And that's fine but it ain't really my thing. At least a bench is something that is built, which automatically makes it a more worthy matter of time and consideration than tools...which new woodworkers spend way too much time obsessing over when they should be building instead. I like Schwarz as a human, but anyone who's okay with using crap wood and nails in his work (historically accurate or not)...well... ...we have the vaccine for polio, too...so no more need for all the iron lungs laying around. Let's toss them in the landfill along with all the cut nails and pine. Welcome to the 21st Century, Chris. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gilgaron Posted March 20, 2017 Report Share Posted March 20, 2017 He's the first to tell you not to listen to him if you find a way that works better for you. I've met him a few times and he's cool, I don't think he enjoys getting the messiah treatment by some of the fans. I have quite a few of the Lost Art Press books and have enjoyed all of them, but if you're not interested in a historical bent then obviously they won't appeal. The only criticism of the business ventures would be that I can't wrap my head around the Crucible Tools offerings, at prices that I could have the items hand forged by a blacksmith. But I guess things cost what they cost, not much economics of scale having niche items manufactured. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post jjongsma Posted March 20, 2017 Popular Post Report Share Posted March 20, 2017 6 hours ago, Llama said: That's not really my issue with him... I am all for spreading information. What I do find irritating is people seem to take his word as gospel. There are plenty of benches that break his rules, and people do just fine! It sounds like you have an issue with his "followers" rather than an issue with him, then. I feel the same way, I think. I think Chris Schwarz says a lot of really valuable things and I enjoy reading his stuff, but I usually just ignore the stuff that I don't find interesting or useful. But apparently there is a not-insignificant number of people who can't seem to think critically about things and act as if his every proclamation is infallible. On the other hand, there is also a not-insignificant number of people who seem to direct vitriol at him for no good reason... 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prov163 Posted March 20, 2017 Report Share Posted March 20, 2017 I enjoy reading and watching Schwarz's material - and Marc's, Pekovich's, Kenney's, St. Roy's, David Marks', ShannFitzpatrick, many of y'all's and others. I glean as much useable information as possible from the best teachers/practitioners I can identify. I like learning so I tend to immerse myself in whatever I'm doing. I keep whatever fits my methodology and practice then file away the rest. I do agree with Eric about emphasis. I need to build a new workbench but haven't decided which style. Being exposed to a variety is great but in the final analysis it must be based on how I work not how someone else does. Mine will incorporate what fits my approach which I am still refining. As someone who works in the field of history, I like learning about how woodworking used to be done even though I have no intention of ever building a Roman style bench. I equally appreciate Schwarz's study of the Studley tool cabinet though I will never build one. Keeping the history alive is a valuable and enlightening practice. I sincerely appreciate Chris' willingness to delve into difficult texts and trying to bring out some nuggets worth considering. I ain't reading Ruobo's tome As I improve and evolve in woodworking I tend to gravitate to people who challenge me and share a design aesthetic. I started out watching YouTube guys using pallets and plywood (forgive me Father Eric, for I have sinned - LOL) to build basic projects with pocket holes and butt joints. It was a starting point. I'm at a different stage now and am grateful there are so many opportunities and platforms to grow in the craft - including this forum!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barron Posted March 20, 2017 Report Share Posted March 20, 2017 If you read Schwarz's book on benches he boils it down pretty well. Heavy, stable, not too wide and as long as you can fit into your space. The Roman bench fits with his ideas from the Anarchist Design Book on building furniture (and benches) without a lot of tools or difficult joints. And he clearly states you can ignore his advice. I've always found it pretty darn good. And Eric, he only uses nails in some of his project. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Llama Posted March 20, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 20, 2017 Never said his advice was bad. Only that he has ALOT of it. There is nothing inherently wrong with that either. He is a little funny about calling them suggestions and not rules. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wtnhighlander Posted March 21, 2017 Report Share Posted March 21, 2017 I find the historical aspects of Schwarz's bech books fascinating. However,he keeps going BACKWARD through tbe evolution of the woodworking bench. Outside of historical re-enactment, why would anyone want to build a more primative bench? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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